A spontaneus casting Mage

Plane Sailing said:
Which do you think is the worst spellcasting system?

GURPS has a lot of potential, but I find it awful in practice. Learning spells as skills could work, but not each individual spell. I find it totally impractical for all but the very lowest of magic levels.

Shadowrun, much as I love the game, isn't too hot, either, for similar reasons as GURPS. Now, if you could learn whole types of spells as one skill, that might work. But, as is, I just don't like it.

The worst, though, was Runequest. I never saw the later editions of Runequest, but in an early edition, they had spells (about the power level of a 2nd level D&D spell) that cost permanent Constitution drain to cast. And I couldn't find any rules for regaining Con (although I didn't read the whole book). Maybe some people could enjoy that sort of magic, but not me.
 

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The insanity of dissing Runequest

Cyberzombie said:
The worst, though, was Runequest. I never saw the later editions of Runequest, but in an early edition, they had spells (about the power level of a 2nd level D&D spell) that cost permanent Constitution drain to cast. And I couldn't find any rules for regaining Con (although I didn't read the whole book). Maybe some people could enjoy that sort of magic, but not me.

Since ENWorld is a nice, family-approved Web forum, I'm going to refrain from flaming you outright for a comment like this. Instead, let me simply "correct your thinking" on this matter, as you are mis-remembering the magic rules from RQ.

Runequest had two forms of magic (three if you want to go as far as 3rd edition, but let's leave that for now).

Battle Magic was basically a point-based system. You could learn a number of spells limited by your INT. Casting these spells cost you Magic Points (based on your POW stat), the cost increasing with the power of the spell. Battle Magic was fairly common and fairly weak.

Divine Magic is what I think you're referring to. Learning Divine Magic required the character to be both a fairly involved member of a cult (a.k.a. religion) and to sacrifice permanent points of POW. However, Divine Magic is really powerful, and works 100% of the time (unless you're heavily encumbered when casting, and even this it's like 90%-99%). However, gaining increased POW was part of the RQ experience system, so the sacrifice could eventually be replaced.

In future, if your memory of a game system you didn't even read all the way through is so spotty, you may wish to refrain from commenting on it at all, much less labeling it "the worst ever."

RQ2 was probably one of the greatest RPGs in the history of the hobby. It was incredibly innovative for its time, and it had one of the most interesting, fleshed out settings the hobby has ever seen. I don't think a less-than-stellar supplement was ever published for it.

Anyway, if you need a magic system that could be termed the worst, you couldn't do better than, imho, 2nd ed. Chivalry & Sorcery. That system took hours of calculations just to create a magician who had the basic tools necessary to play an active role in the game. And then you had these convoluted requisite chians of spells, e.g., to cast a fireball you needed to know Create/Detatch Fire, Move Fire, Direct Fire, BlahThis Fire, BlahSomethingElse Fire, and so on. I've almost never seen a system that did so much to get in the way of actual play as C&S2e.
 

Re: The insanity of dissing Runequest

buzz said:
Since ENWorld is a nice, family-approved Web forum, I'm going to refrain from flaming you outright for a comment like this... In future, if your memory of a game system you didn't even read all the way through is so spotty, you may wish to refrain from commenting on it at all, much less labeling it "the worst ever."

I'm sure he will try to remember that his memory of the game system is poor, next time...

If that wasn't your flame version, I'd hate to see how crispy you are capable of getting. As far as I'm concerned, your response was inappropriate and rude. It was just his opinion, which obviously differs from your own.
 

Re: Re: The insanity of dissing Runequest

Mistwell said:
As far as I'm concerned, your response was inappropriate and rude. It was just his opinion, which obviously differs from your own.
I'll second that. How hard would it have been for you to just correct CZ without getting all testy about it?
 

Re: Re: Re: The insanity of dissing Runequest

Bartholomew Fair said:
I'll second that. How hard would it have been for you to just correct CZ without getting all testy about it?

In all honesty, that's what I thought I was doing. Apologies if I came off too strong.

People dissing game systems they've never read or can't remember the rules to is kind of a pet peeve of mine, though. Perhaps I'm over-sensitive (or I spend too much time on RPG.net).

Anyway, my apologies. I encourage everyone to check out Runequest if they get the chance.
 

Re: Re: The insanity of dissing Runequest

Mistwell said:
I'm sure he will try to remember that his memory of the game system is poor, next time...

See my apology/clarification above.

Regardless, if one is aware (as Cyberzombie was) that they aren't remembering something correctly, I still think that it'd be better to say "I remeber this being really wacked; am I remembering this correctly?" than "I don't remember and I didn't even read the whole book in the first palce, but it totally sucked."

The former is asking for clarification. The latter is being kind of a doof, in my book.

But, like I said, my real point was to educate people about Runequest, not flame Cyberzombie.
 


hong said:
So, any chance of a d20 Runequest any time soon?

Probably as soon as that whole "monkeys flying out of our butts" thing gets set up. After that it'll be a piece o' cake. :)
 

What edition of Runequest was out in 1981? That was my only experience with the game. After playing for a short while I left, never to return. In fact, the biggest reason that I had never played Call of Chthulu was that Chaosium was using the same basic gaming mechanics.

However, I would say that there was a worse system than "loonquest" and that was Empire of the Petal Throne. I never tried to set up a spell caster in Chivalry and Sorcery so I can't comment on it. Oh, and Chart Law was somewhat worse that the standard D&D system too.
 

Unbelieveable

Pagan priest said:
However, I would say that there was a worse system than "loonquest" and that was Empire of the Petal Throne.

Man, more people dissing the great Runequest, and now EPT! Whipper-snappers.

Wasn't EPT (I assume you mean the first Tekumel RPG, not Swords & Glory, which was also convoluted, or that TOME version) just OD&D with a few tweaks?

If the mighty Runequest is bad, what the heck do you consider good?
 

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