Adding time to gain surges in-game

[MarauderX]

Problem (as I see it): Since PCs can currently get up to full strength again after resting for just 6 hours, the speed they can ascend from level 1 to 30 could be as short as a year in game time.

Solution (proposed): Each 6 hour period lets a PC regain 1 healing surge. No more than 1 healing surge can be recovered in a 24-hour period by natural means. Rituals or other magic can increase the speed of healing.

What kind of unexpected upheavals could I be in for? Sure, the party might plan to rely on temporary HP or using other surge-less healing, but it could slow down the party from stripping a dozen dungeons in less than a week in-game time.

 

[Saeviomagy]

Problem (as I see it): Since PCs can currently get up to full strength again after resting for just 6 hours, the speed they can ascend from level 1 to 30 could be as short as a year in game time.

Solution (proposed): Each 6 hour period lets a PC regain 1 healing surge. No more than 1 healing surge can be recovered in a 24-hour period by natural means. Rituals or other magic can increase the speed of healing.

What kind of unexpected upheavals could I be in for? Sure, the party might plan to rely on temporary HP or using other surge-less healing, but it could slow down the party from stripping a dozen dungeons in less than a week in-game time.

It seems silly that your warrior will take several days to fill up to full while the mage will take 1 or 2.

Also - are all your dungeons right next to each other or something? And are your players just dungeon runners with no other life to speak of?

Travel time, ale and whores - that's what stops your PCs from stripping a dozen dungeons in less than a week.

Not to mention the lack of "bob's omnibus of unplundered dungeons" at the local buy more.

 

[the Jester]

Mostly I suspect you'll see more week-long stretches of inactivity that you have to handwave.

 

[FireLance]

Just bring back training times: one month to gain a level, one year to gain a paragon path and another year to gain an epic destiny.

 

[AeroDm]

In general I don't recommend using important mechanics to fix some other problem in the game. What you've identified is that you dislike how rapidly people can gain levels, but your looking for the solution in a mechanic that balances how much someone can heal per combat. This is the ol' taking a hatchet when you need a scalpel type situation.

If the speed of ascension is an issue (and I personally agree that it is), then fix it directly. Either motivate *players* to take downtime by adding some incentive to the game or force *characters* to take downtime by adding some limitation.

 

[TheClone]

I guess training times will be it. Just having to spend one day at an appropriate training facility forces leaving the dungeon and traveling to a major city at higher levels.

I personally have more difficulties from the simulationist's point of view with the "instant heal", but that has also been addressed at least once.

4e is a system that allows hack slay to its purest. If you just use the rules and don't think twice, you end up playing Diablo. If you want a more immersive or simulationist approach or whatever else you have to add your own flavor to it manually. Plan hooks, describe scenes, add tension, whatever. The possibilities are endless, but you have to do that all as an addition to the rules.

 

[the Jester]

I agree that the pace of advancement is ridiculous- I use travel time, bad weather downtime, winter downtime, etc. etc. to combat it, with reasonable but not complete success.

 

[jbear]

Such a slow rate of surge recovery would mean death in my campaign. But I also wanted to implement a slower recovery system that depends on the conditions the PCs are resting in.

I came up with this which I have in a chart for quick reference.

Advantages:
Being wounded becomes more important, a little grit is added while full recovery is possible depending on favourable the situation.
The pace is slowed a little but not so drastically as to draw PCs actions to a complete halt every single day.
Finding the right place to rest is an issue. Returning to town is beneficial. Paying for a good place to stay or having contacts in town is also benficial.
The Skills involved become more useful/important in the game.

Disadvantages:
Slows down the game real time as rolls are made when the party takes an extended rest
Potentially draws the action to a slow as PCs have to bail from a situation to recover Surges. This may be sometimes good, but if you want to move the story, it could also be bad.
Players untrained in Endurance will suffer from this. Low CON becomes bad. (which kind of makes sense though right?)

Take a geez, criticism/suggestions welcome

 

[LostSoul]

I did that in my game (1 healing surge per day of rest). I also do a training time thing. These really eat up the in-game time.

I also added a bunch of stuff that deals with the changing setting. Let's see what I wrote:

SETTLEMENT GROWTH
Time: One month
Requires Safety: No

This cycle of play deals with NPC reactions to the actions the PCs have taken. Settlements grow and prosper (or wither and die) based on the PC's influence over the local economy; NPC lairs grow or shrink; PCs gain respect and friends in settlements they've had an influence upon; and monsters may move into cleared hexes.​

This cycle of play does a few things.

I keep track of the amount of GPs the PCs spend in different towns. These GP are like XP for the settlement; if the PCs spend enough, the town will get bigger. That means NPCs who can facilitate your adventuring (through magic items, rituals, and hirelings) will show up in town.

I keep track of some of the actions the PCs take. Those are tallied up and become modifiers for a "Reaction Roll" that I make for the settlement. This determines how the NPCs feel about the PCs - it sets their default reaction as well as the complexity of social skill challenges run against those NPCs.

I keep track of a different set of actions, make another roll, and that determines the PC's Influence over the town. High enough and they will consider you a legitimate ruler - even if they hate your guts (see the above roll). If you have high enough influence you can start taxing the town.

I assign some actions to powerful NPCs. If those actions are successful (yeah, I do end up rolling a d20 or two for the NPCs), then the NPC attracts recruits to his or her or its cause.

There's extra bookkeeping, but most of it takes place during times of table inactivity and I let the players keep track of their actions & GP spent. The NPC stuff is pretty easy, usually done during prep.

 

[AeroDm]

A friend of mine got annoyed at how easily hit points returned and how being knocked unconscious seemed rather trivial. He instituted a house rule that a failed death saving throw applied a "Wound" that reduced maximum surges by one. You died when you ran out of surges instead of three failed death saving throws. This did two things. First, it actually made characters heartier, but it offset that by the second change, being unconscious was now much more punitive. It didn't just end after this battle, it might make you weaker in subsequent battles as well.

He also disliked the rapid rate of leveling, so decided that wounds only healed at a rate not conducive to adventuring. Because wounds then only healed during downtime, you can set a heal rate that accords with your preferred general passage of time. If you want a day or two to pass, have wounds return daily. Want to slow it down? Have wounds return weekly. Even more? Wounds return monthly.

[Note, this may seem to cut against my earlier post in this thread but really they work together. The thing this rule was trying to fix was the incentive to not get knocked unconscious. The ability to fix the passage of time issue was ancillary.]