Adjusting XP for high power parties

[Dustin Clingman]

Hi Folks!

I have been experimenting with an idea for a couple of months now and I still have mixed opinions on the subject. Basiclly my issue revolves around the experience reward based on level and not on the individual attributes for a character.

I propose that a party where the attribute totals are around 100-108 be awarded 80% of a monster's given CR value against the average party of the level.

The average exends out across the party so as not to punish the one average guy.

My feeling is that no one wants to play a weakling, but that it should be much more rewarding to play with less natural abilities.

I would like to hear opinions on the idea.

Thanks,

Dustin

 

[CRGreathouse]

I've worked out a system to do this (though it's individual, not averaged... the weaklings will get more XP, but they're weaker!), but it's hellaciously complex. I'll use it in an upcoming campaign and see how well it works.

My system assigns various stats ECL modifiers, as well as the normal sources for ECL (race, level). I then modify the ECLs for more precision -- hobgoblins aren't ECL +1 but ECL +.4, for example. I then redid the XP: CR/ECL chart to extend it over nonintegers.

Essentially, I made a big excel document and punch in numbers from here on out; it spits the XP back at me.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Hi Folks!

My feeling is that no one wants to play a weakling, but that it should be much more rewarding to play with less natural abilities.

Hm... usually it's not a matter of want. It's a matter of must, because you roll your ability scores (or maybe buy them). As the characters (usually) all use the same method for rolling that stuff, they have about the same ability scores (if someone's really lucky and gets very good rolls, you should not punish him. And if the scores are to bad, he can always reroll)

Despite that, I for one like to keep the things simple.

 

[Dustin Clingman]

Well one thing I have noted with the people I have played with is that they tend to roll until they get something that they are comfortable with.

This doesn't mean that they are playing all 18s, but it does or can mean at least one attribute at 20 and a couple of others at 17-18. With the Character Gen in the PHB or E-tools, it's easy to just keep rolling.

My mindset is that I don't want to force someone to play a moron or a total wimp who is going to be dead in the first melee, but I also want to balance out the benefit of rolling till you like the character.

Dustin

 

[dcollins]

Well one thing I have noted with the people I have played with is that they tend to roll until they get something that they are comfortable with.

The solution is to roll scores once, by hand, in front of the DM. Period. That's what my games have done for 20 years now.

If you let PCs be generated off-line, then you definitely should use the point-buy system. Anything else is basically degenerate.

 

[Fenes 2]

In one game we use the "place 75 points among your stats as you see fit, with a 1-1 ratio." In another we use the "Choose the stats of your PC as you see fit, subject to DM approval". Both work well, and make for balanced parties. There are no "dump stats", since Charisma is very important in either campaign.

Edit: Almost forgot the main point: We don't follow the exp tables at all, we just level up when we see fit. And even back when we used XP, the DM just handed it out at the end of an adventure based on what he judged right both for the adventure and the campaign progress. It made for a lot less combat-focused game in our case, since all exp awards were basically story awards.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Well one thing I have noted with the people I have played with is that they tend to roll until they get something that they are comfortable with.

Then you have the wrong method of handling ability score rolls! In almost all the games I played in (and in those where friends played in) you have a certain method of rolling (Standard 3e 4d6, 4d6 seven times, 3d6 12 times, sometimes even 3d6 18 times, always keeping the best values) and then you rolled. You usually have the right to drop the first (and maybe second) course (and in case of 3e games, results that were entitled to a re-roll even by the PHB/DMG didn't count for that) and that's it. If you have no 18, you can't change it. No rerolling until you like the values, cause then you can as well give them the values they like, for else they will roll until they have them anyway.

And of course these rolls were made in presence of the DM, not at home.

 

[bret]

The solution is to roll scores once, by hand, in front of the DM. Period. That's what my games have done for 20 years now.

If you let PCs be generated off-line, then you definitely should use the point-buy system. Anything else is basically degenerate.

If you gave me the choice between rolling 4d6 or point buy, I would almost always go point buy.

I'm one of those people that just seems to be unlucky with dice. In groups that had a still-birth rule (any character without a stat of greater than or equal to X is discarded), it would almost always take me multiple attempts to generate a character. In groups without such a rule, frequently the GM would decide such a rule was needed.

It isn't a problem playing the wimp occationally. It is a problem when you always have inferior attributes to the rest of the group.

I really like point buy because it is more fair.

 

[phillipjp]

We don't follow the exp tables at all, we just level up when we see fit.

How does your group handle item creation? Do the creators still pay an xp cost?

 

[Kae'Yoss]

In one game we use the "place 75 points among your stats as you see fit, with a 1-1 ratio." In another we use the "Choose the stats of your PC as you see fit, subject to DM approval". Both work well, and make for balanced parties. There are no "dump stats", since Charisma is very important in either campaign.

Edit: Almost forgot the main point: We don't follow the exp tables at all, we just level up when we see fit. And even back when we used XP, the DM just handed it out at the end of an adventure based on what he judged right both for the adventure and the campaign progress. It made for a lot less combat-focused game in our case, since all exp awards were basically story awards.

Well, if the whole game's not so rules- and combat- oriented anyway, the ability scores won't have that much importance anyway. But in a combat-heavy (or even "normal" campaign, that might not work so good.)


And I'm no friend of the non-wighted point buy. Higher values are something special, as the chance to get one is lower (you have, with the standard method, about 1:45 chance to get one 18 amongst your scores), and the point buy should reflect that.