Advanced Players Guide vs. Forgotten Heroes

[TerraDave]

Both Advanced Player's Guide and Forgotten Heroes essentially do the same thing: put back the missing classes. I'm curious what people's experiences with them are.

But APG does more than that. And I like the other bits more (though the classes are fine).

 

[Byronic]

I disliked both of them, so I choose "read neither"

 

[Zaukrie]

Matthew, I have the APG in pdf. You can read it if you want, let me know. I've printed the first few pages of each class. Of course, if you plan to use it, you'll need to buy a copy for yourself. I think Jason still has the hardcopy I ordered, that they couldn't get at first.

I like most everything in APG, frankly.

 

[Mathew_Freeman]

I've only read the APG and seen the classes in play once, but it seemed to work well.

The Monk did seem underpowered in terms of melee damage, compared to the other classes (including non-strikers) but that might balance out at higher levels.

 

[MatthewJHanson]

Thanks for all your opinions. I also have APG (though thanks Zaukrie). I hadn't learned about FH until after I bought it, and this thread validates my decision.

Do you think the decreased damage for APG Monks comes because they have to spend a minor action on it every turn? (Compared to no action for rogues, or a minor per target for ranger and warlock.)

 

[catsclaw227]

Well, even if my players aren't interested in the classes, I might just use them as NPC classes and take powers from them for use with monsters. I am guessing that they both have their merits.

 

[Zaukrie]

My PCs have already faced a monk inspired by this book, Matthew may recall the dolgaunt monks and their minor actions....

 

[tuxgeo]

Both Advanced Player's Guide and Forgotten Heroes essentially do the same thing: put back the missing classes. I'm curious what people's experiences with them are.

I have both of them (FH as PDF, APG in hardcopy); I have read FH more thoroughly than the APG.
I voted that I like both equally. I should also mention these differences: in my opinion, FH has a better Druid while APG has a better Bard ("Troubadour").
I prefer the Druid to the Nature Priest because the Druid can Wildshape at Level 1, can Summon an Animal Companion to flank and threaten OAs, and gets a better (IMHO) selection of At-Will attack powers, while the Nature Priest has an overabundance of low-level powers requiring Sustain Minor to use for longer than a single round.
I prefer the Troubadour to the Bard because the Troubadour has a choice of music or symbolism: one Troubadour could play an instrument while another one wields a (heraldic?) Standard instead. Also, I was confused by reading the Bardic powers in FH, because they involve page-flipping: there is a list of the songs that Bards can learn, and the actual power descriptions refer to those songs by name; if a Bard power lets you play "Action Jack" or "Throwdown," you then have to flip back to the table of Songs to find out what that lets you do (or just memorize the Table); I thought it would be better to have each individual power say what it does within the confines of its own text. Also, the Troubadour gets access to a few things from other classes, such as "Cause Fear" from the Cleric, "Beguiling Tongue" from the Warlock, and "Cantrip" and "Disguise Self" from the Wizard.

 

[Evilhalfling]

Do you think the decreased damage for APG Monks comes because they have to spend a minor action on it every turn? (Compared to no action for rogues, or a minor per target for ranger and warlock.)

nope the decreased damage comes from the low multipliers on [w] attacks.
at will = dex only, w(nomod) w(nomod) 1[w]+wis (aoe)
1 enc : 1[w], 0,0, w (no mod)
1 daily : (by enemy),0,2[w]
3 enc : (by enemy), 2[w],1[w]
===
13 enc ; 3w 2w, 2w, 0

this is not striker damage. Plus you are using simple melee weapons or +3(1d6) unarmed.

 

[Dagredhel]

I've read the Advanced Player's Guide.

I loathe 4e. Hate it, hate it, hate it. Don't like it, either. And have I mentioned I'm not a fan of 4e?

An yet... The Advanced Player's Guide almost changed my mind. Seriously. I thought it was so well written, I *almost* changed my mind.

So... Despise 4e, but *still* really like the APG. Take that for what it's worth.