Again another example of CHA as dump stat

[DarkMaster]

Well, it helps encourage people to put points in cha if you make them roll their social skills when they're interacting with others.

That's what I do, and I would like WotC to do the same, since they should be the reference.

 

[FireLance]

[Sarcasm]Hey, but it isn't REAL ROLEPLAYING (tm) unless your Charisma 1 half-orc can sway an entire kingdom to his side by making a really good speech.[/Sarcasm]

 

[Kae'Yoss]

I'd use Charisma as a dump stat for alot of characters as well if I were forced to use the anemic point system where you can't even fashion a character with stats as good as you are personally.

Just a justification. Aside from the fact that I'm usually generous with the points in point buy, I'd penalize everyone who took any mental ability score as a dump stat and didn't play it properly!

Well, it helps encourage people to put points in cha if you make them roll their social skills when they're interacting with others.

Amen! Damn all powergamers who use cha as a dump stat and play their character as the Very Best Diplomat In The Multiverse And Everywhere Else.

 

[Darklone]

I would think a leader of greedy, lazy mercenaries that only wanted to loot would have to have a hell of a high charisma. Otherwise, they'd be looting *his* corpse.

Don't really agree. As long as he keeps them fat and happy and kills the guys who want to stab him at night once per week, they might as well follow him... and take their chances at night next month.

 

[Celtavian]

re

Just use more points then.

joe b.

Aren't the designers working off the point buy in the PHB? That is far to few points. They think epic heroes can be built off 32 points. Maybe you can have the attitude of an epic hero with 32 points, but you surely won't have the stats of an epic hero. They should have officially raised the point total up to 40 points for epic heroes.

 

[Old Gumphrey]

The skill issue is probably a holdover from 2e, when clerics could cast in armor 'just because' and when the bad guys 'just knew' a lot of stuff. Of course, as someone pointed out an anemic point buy, the number of skill points is also anemic. It's pretty hard in core D&D to give characters a good assortment of skills without being a rogue or someone with an obscenely high Int stat; so I guess the designers were compensating by just cutting all that stupid RP stuff out of their NPCs.

 

[frugal]

Amen! Damn all powergamers who use cha as a dump stat and play their character as the Very Best Diplomat In The Multiverse And Everywhere Else.

As someone currently playing a diplomat it annoys the hell out of me that I have spent the past 14 levels working on the social skills, yet when it comes to a diplmatic situation every character from the cha 8 half orc upwards feels that they can talk us out of it ;(

 

[DarkMaster]

As someone currently playing a diplomat it annoys the hell out of me that I have spent the past 14 levels working on the social skills, yet when it comes to a diplmatic situation every character from the cha 8 half orc upwards feels that they can talk us out of it ;(

That all depends on the DM. In my campaign unless your character would be speaking the results could be disastrous. The Cha 8 1/2 orc thinking that he is saying something to calm the demon would end up angering him. Not because his idea was not good but because his character has a hard time expressing his taught or he just used a very sensitive inapropriate joke.
But I would allow the other player to suggest you stuff to say.

 

[DarkMaster]

Aren't the designers working off the point buy in the PHB? That is far to few points. They think epic heroes can be built off 32 points. Maybe you can have the attitude of an epic hero with 32 points, but you surely won't have the stats of an epic hero. They should have officially raised the point total up to 40 points for epic heroes.

I don't agree someone with 3 16 is pretty heroic to me. Don't forget that the average human stat is 10-11.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Aren't the designers working off the point buy in the PHB? That is far to few points. They think epic heroes can be built off 32 points. Maybe you can have the attitude of an epic hero with 32 points, but you surely won't have the stats of an epic hero. They should have officially raised the point total up to 40 points for epic heroes.

Epic heroes are those with 21 or more levels

But what stats does an epic hero have? Did Frodo have 18's across the board? I don't think so. Yet, he's an epic hero, for he succeeded in bringing the Ring to Mount Doom. Your deeds, not your stats, determine whether you are epic. The other is just the power level - you can have a great hero with 25 Points Buy.

And to get this straight: I like my stats high, too - all these large numbers as bonuses to my rolls are very pleasant. But I know that this doesn't determine whether my character is a hero or not (remember: your average human has something like 15 Points Buy, with all 10's and 11's - compared to that a guy with Str 14 is pretty impressive)

As someone currently playing a diplomat it annoys the hell out of me that I have spent the past 14 levels working on the social skills, yet when it comes to a diplmatic situation every character from the cha 8 half orc upwards feels that they can talk us out of it ;(

As has been said: A good DM would cure them of thinking that way...