Alienist (from Complete Arcane) - worth it ?

[Nifft]

I have no problem with the insanity, with the social skill penalty, or with "paying for" your PrC as you gain powers beyond those that a normal dude has.

But I do have a problem with paying the price and then losing power (& flexibility).

The 3.0e class may have been overboard, but the 3.5e version is too much of a nerf IMHO.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Koewn]

The modified Alienist we use eschews toughness (because it's screamingly lame) and instead gets DR 1/- and DR 2/-. Dunno if that helps out any or not, since I never got into melee

Ooze mephits...(stinking cloud)

That's only 1/day though. Still better off just casting it yourself.

Eh. I'd love to see the Summons reworked in a modular way...I wonder if you could take the example provided by the PHB2's Druid Shapeshift (you get these certain abilities and we don't care what it looks like) and apply that to the Summon lists?

Koewn

 

[IanB]

I have no problem with the insanity, with the social skill penalty, or with "paying for" your PrC as you gain powers beyond those that a normal dude has.

But I do have a problem with paying the price and then losing power (& flexibility).

The 3.0e class may have been overboard, but the 3.5e version is too much of a nerf IMHO.

Cheers, -- N

This is just a question of design philosophy. If it were up to me, all prestige classes would represent a loss of overall power compared to base classes, with the benefit being increased power in a narrow focus. As they stand, they've deviated significantly from what I think their role was originally intended to be.

 

[PallidPatience]

I have no problem with paying for what you get. I have a problem with paying so much for TOUGHNESS.

 

[Nifft]

This is just a question of design philosophy. If it were up to me, all prestige classes would represent a loss of overall power compared to base classes, with the benefit being increased power in a narrow focus.

I'm not arguing against that at all.

It's just that an Alienist pays to be a cool summoner, and in exchange... becomes a sucky summoner.

That's why I don't like it.

Cheers, -- N

 

[frankthedm]

It's just that an Alienist pays to be a cool summoner, and in exchange... becomes a sucky summoner.

An Alienist pays to get to call forth horrors from outside the Multiverse. Something no one else can do and something that most gods of magic try to prevent. For that the cost is high. If that seems too high, then you are not devout [insane] enough to [from] the forces of the far realm.

I would love to play one, but my party members would be wise enough to kill such a character in his sleep if the DM allowed me to play an Alienist.

Always having that first hit land can matter. Shame summons don’t often have two handed weapons & power attack.

 

[IceFractal]

What I dislike about Alienist is that apparently the hideous powers of the realm beyond are ... extra hit points. Spooooky. I guess I should keep an eye on those Dwarves - they're practically pseudonatural, especially Dwarven Defenders.

Ok, it isn't all hit points, but it is all rather dull. You take significant penalties in order to gain some minor bonuses that aren't very special or far-realmsy. I think you'd be better off playing a straight Wizard, maybe with a useful summoning PrC, and just describe your summoned creatures and spells as unnatural-looking .

 

[PallidPatience]

Yep. That's my point indeed, IF. Major penalties for Toughness is not only borderline useless, but very dull. The DR mentioned upthread would be a decent trade, or, you know, something having to do with summoning horrible monstrosities. -_-

 

[Cheiromancer]

The 1 round casting time of the summon spells is irritating- the monster doesn't appear until the next round, and the casting can be disrupted from when you start to cast until just before your next initiative count.

The True Strike ability then takes a standard action to use (it's a Supernatural ability, right)? Thus adding another round before anything interesting happens.

After these two rounds have gone by, well then the pseudonatural dire weasel action can begin. But it seems to me that the delay is really a killer here.

I think Endurance + Diehard would be better abilities than a double dose of Toughness.

 

[shilsen]

The True Strike ability then takes a standard action to use (it's a Supernatural ability, right)? Thus adding another round before anything interesting happens.

No. Pseudonatural creatures don't take any extra time, but simply benefit from the +20 on their first attack.