Alternate D20 Magic Systems - Your Experiences
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Crothian
First Post
We used a spell point system similiar to psioics but this was prior to the release of the psioics system. IOt worked well, sorcerers had a lot more spell points then any other class and after fifth level I think he rarely ran out of spells. THe cleric liked it the most since they havd access to so many spells. We played with it but then eventually scratched it to go with a skill check system.
Basically to cast a spell the class needed to make a knowledge something roll. THe DC was like 10+ level of the spell. And after so many spells were cast based on one's constitution that DC got progressively harder. I liked this sytstem better at it never had a caster totally out of spells. They always had a chance. And even fully rested the caster could roll bad and magic was not as reliable.
Basically to cast a spell the class needed to make a knowledge something roll. THe DC was like 10+ level of the spell. And after so many spells were cast based on one's constitution that DC got progressively harder. I liked this sytstem better at it never had a caster totally out of spells. They always had a chance. And even fully rested the caster could roll bad and magic was not as reliable.
Crothian
First Post
Arnix said:
You mean medium level casters being able to cast low level spells easily?
A nat one on the skill check is failure so it didn't al;ways work. The amount of successfully cast spell levels was tracked and the more that were cast the harder the check got. So, it was never casting lots of little spells, the odds slowly caught up with the caster. And there were plenty of times it seemed that they failed their caster roll at a critical time.
arscott
First Post
Systems I've had experience with:
D&D Psionics--The standard 3.5 psionics system is basically the 3.5 magic system altered to work more smoothly. If you enjoy the general power level of standard casters but abhor the inflexibility of fire-and-forget and spell slots, psionics is the system for you.
d20 Modern FX--This isn't quite an alternate magic system in its own right, as it's merely a short reprint of the 3.0 magic and psionics rules. Still, while the means to achieve the goal is largely the same, the goal itself is somewhat different--Because d20 Modern spells are harder to get, and because powerful non-magical weapons and devices exist in d20 Modern, Modern spellcasters are less about blasting foes and more about the interesting non-offensive abilities they can acchieve through magical means.
d20 Star Wars Force Powers--As a non-jedi character in a starwars game, I spent the entire time sitting on a sidelines while the force-using characters accomplished the party's goals. SW force powers by themselves might not be broken, but combined with the other things making jedi cool, it was hard to tell.
Green Ronin's Psychic Handbook--Similar to force powers, and a precursor to the system used in True 20. Unlike force powers, I've never seen problems with these (though they've seen only limited use in my modern campaign). They fit the feel of modern day "psychics" pretty well. I've heard these rules described as fairly low-powered compared to the standard D&D casters, but I've never actually seen both rules used in the same game.
Sleep Dep Creation's SFX Skills--work similarly to the Psychic Handbook rules, but more individualized for specific magical disciplines. So far, only Diabolism and Enochian Theurgy are out, and I've only used Diabolism. Very good flavor, but limited in scope and not really suitible for a standard high-fantasy game.
Elements of Magic: Mythic Earth--This is the one system I own but haven't used. It's skills based, and highly flexible, and it looks pretty awesome. It's too broad in scope and too powerful for the low FX modern campaign I run, but if you're running a high-magic game and want a flexible, skills based system similar to Ars Magica, then it looks like a great choice.
D&D Psionics--The standard 3.5 psionics system is basically the 3.5 magic system altered to work more smoothly. If you enjoy the general power level of standard casters but abhor the inflexibility of fire-and-forget and spell slots, psionics is the system for you.
d20 Modern FX--This isn't quite an alternate magic system in its own right, as it's merely a short reprint of the 3.0 magic and psionics rules. Still, while the means to achieve the goal is largely the same, the goal itself is somewhat different--Because d20 Modern spells are harder to get, and because powerful non-magical weapons and devices exist in d20 Modern, Modern spellcasters are less about blasting foes and more about the interesting non-offensive abilities they can acchieve through magical means.
d20 Star Wars Force Powers--As a non-jedi character in a starwars game, I spent the entire time sitting on a sidelines while the force-using characters accomplished the party's goals. SW force powers by themselves might not be broken, but combined with the other things making jedi cool, it was hard to tell.
Green Ronin's Psychic Handbook--Similar to force powers, and a precursor to the system used in True 20. Unlike force powers, I've never seen problems with these (though they've seen only limited use in my modern campaign). They fit the feel of modern day "psychics" pretty well. I've heard these rules described as fairly low-powered compared to the standard D&D casters, but I've never actually seen both rules used in the same game.
Sleep Dep Creation's SFX Skills--work similarly to the Psychic Handbook rules, but more individualized for specific magical disciplines. So far, only Diabolism and Enochian Theurgy are out, and I've only used Diabolism. Very good flavor, but limited in scope and not really suitible for a standard high-fantasy game.
Elements of Magic: Mythic Earth--This is the one system I own but haven't used. It's skills based, and highly flexible, and it looks pretty awesome. It's too broad in scope and too powerful for the low FX modern campaign I run, but if you're running a high-magic game and want a flexible, skills based system similar to Ars Magica, then it looks like a great choice.
Primitive Screwhead
First Post
Second vote for Elements of Magic {EoM}... Revised or Mythic Earth{ME}.
Both are balanced replacements/additions to the Core magic mechanics altho both come with thier own special flavor changes
EoM: Revised is a point based system where you build spells out of lists of effects. The variety and flexibility of the system is awesome! Essentially every mage makes up thier own spells.
EoM: ME is a skill based system that I have not played, altho I have read through a couple of times.
Both systems have a fairly rapid support system by way of the Enworld Publishers forum where we have been debating, errata, and HR to EoM: Revised since it came out
Both are balanced replacements/additions to the Core magic mechanics altho both come with thier own special flavor changes
EoM: Revised is a point based system where you build spells out of lists of effects. The variety and flexibility of the system is awesome! Essentially every mage makes up thier own spells.
EoM: ME is a skill based system that I have not played, altho I have read through a couple of times.
Both systems have a fairly rapid support system by way of the Enworld Publishers forum where we have been debating, errata, and HR to EoM: Revised since it came out
Eltharon
Explorer
Quick note on EoM.
In the basic file (Elements of Magic, revised), there are only 3 magic using classes. The mage (standard spellcaster) the mageknight (moderate BaB, less spells) and the taskmage (a mage with spellcasting like the mageknight, but with a focus on skills instead of combat).
Lyceian Arcana, I believe (I don't own it--yet) has the other classes.
In the basic file (Elements of Magic, revised), there are only 3 magic using classes. The mage (standard spellcaster) the mageknight (moderate BaB, less spells) and the taskmage (a mage with spellcasting like the mageknight, but with a focus on skills instead of combat).
Lyceian Arcana, I believe (I don't own it--yet) has the other classes.
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Voadam
Legend
3.5 Psionics, point based sorcerers with built in metamagic capabilities. Can front load more spell power. Decent alt spellcaster.
Psionic feats and soulknife, neat focus mechanic for nifty little powers that are mostly encounter rather than day based usages. Very to my taste.
UA spontaneous divine caster. I like this a ton, eliminates prep time which can drag for high level casters and makes individual members of same class different based on spell known selection. Not every cleric can do every divination.
UA Recharge magic variant. Very neat, no tracking slots, only time between casting certain levels of spells.
AE/AU, prepare spell slots then spontaneously cast those slots with some built in metamagic. Knows every spell on list = same customization problem as core cleric, every caster of same class can do exactly the same stuff and everything on list.
Tome of Magic Binders, neat supernatural based possession powers that can be switched around each day but again every binder knows entire list of powers and can prepare to be the same.
Complete Arcane Warlocks. Use all powers at will, blast indefinitely but not that big a bang. Limited options but simple to track mechanics and continual use powers are nice.
Others out there I have but have not gone over in depth: Elements of Magic, Everquest RPG, Occult Lore variants, others.
Psionic feats and soulknife, neat focus mechanic for nifty little powers that are mostly encounter rather than day based usages. Very to my taste.
UA spontaneous divine caster. I like this a ton, eliminates prep time which can drag for high level casters and makes individual members of same class different based on spell known selection. Not every cleric can do every divination.
UA Recharge magic variant. Very neat, no tracking slots, only time between casting certain levels of spells.
AE/AU, prepare spell slots then spontaneously cast those slots with some built in metamagic. Knows every spell on list = same customization problem as core cleric, every caster of same class can do exactly the same stuff and everything on list.
Tome of Magic Binders, neat supernatural based possession powers that can be switched around each day but again every binder knows entire list of powers and can prepare to be the same.
Complete Arcane Warlocks. Use all powers at will, blast indefinitely but not that big a bang. Limited options but simple to track mechanics and continual use powers are nice.
Others out there I have but have not gone over in depth: Elements of Magic, Everquest RPG, Occult Lore variants, others.
Particle_Man
Explorer
I second Elements of Magic, though it has a learning curve.
Going the other way, I luuuuuuuve the Warlock. Not sure what a campaign would be like with the Warlocks as the only magic types though.
Going the other way, I luuuuuuuve the Warlock. Not sure what a campaign would be like with the Warlocks as the only magic types though.
