D&D General Alternate firearms rules (input needed)

[aco175]

Firearms will only have one range, with no damage on successful save for pistol, and 1/2 damage on save for musket (which I will likely rename arquebus). That will be the ability of the arquebus. Not sure about adding a rider to the pistol damage anymore. I like the idea of allowing still greater range with advantage on saving throws.

I like the advantage on saves for long range. Pistols are not range weapons more than 30ft

I’m having a hard time rationalizing upgraded damage à la cantrip other than having firearms stay relevant at higher level (which I can live with). I might have them deal an extra damage die per extra attack feature instead

What about exploding dice like Chromatic Orb. Have pistols deal 2d4 and if you roll doubles, you add another die, and another if that is the same number. Rifles deal 3d4 and add 1d4 if you have the feat for a better chance of rolling doubles.

 

[David Howery]

Anyone can wield a musket or a pistol,

that's a bit of a problem, and one reason why firearms are bit loopy for D&D rules. Muzzleloaders were distinctly difficult to load and fire (particularly for matchlocks, which are rather unsuitable for a typical 'adventurers going into a dungeon' setting).... without training on how to do it, you can't really do it. OTOH, old firearms don't take years of training either, you can become proficient with them way faster than a sword. Maybe an easy shortcut would be 'have to have proficiency with firearms to use them'? I'm not very familiar with the 3E and later rules, so not really sure.

 

[Laurefindel]

that's a bit of a problem, and one reason why firearms are bit loopy for D&D rules. Muzzleloaders were distinctly difficult to load and fire (particularly for matchlocks, which are rather unsuitable for a typical 'adventurers going into a dungeon' setting).... without training on how to do it, you can't really do it. OTOH, old firearms don't take years of training either, you can become proficient with them way faster than a sword. Maybe an easy shortcut would be 'have to have proficiency with firearms to use them'? I'm not very familiar with the 3E and later rules, so not really sure.

Oh but there is a proficiency for these firearms. Without the proficiency, you cannot load a firearm, and you don’t add your proficiency bonus to the saving throw. Without the proficiency, characters can fire a loaded firearm, but the target has a higher chance to succeeding on the save.

 

[David Howery]

Oh but there is a proficiency for these firearms. Without the proficiency, you cannot load a firearm, and you don’t add your proficiency bonus to the saving throw. Without the proficiency, characters can fire a loaded firearm, but the target has a higher chance to succeeding on the save.

so, the existing rules already cover it? Okay.

 

[haakon1]

I get the concept of having unique rules.

Personally I would not go that way. I’d stick closer to the mechanics for similar weapons, like heavy crossbows.

Maybe go with heavy damage and slow reloading, but keep the defense as AC instead of a save. But have the AC without armor?

 

[Xeviat]

I had worked on something similar a while back, but for crossbows at first. I wanted to have crossbows be simple and have firearms be the martial equivalent. Since combat is seemingly balanced around 3 rounds, I was trying to balance it so that if someone did Fire, Reload, Fire as their 3 rounds, it would be equivalent (which would mean the dpr target would be around 1.5). I also wanted to ensure it was 1 shot per attack, regardless of extra attack, and to have cantrip damage scaling.

After polling my players, the majority said they'd only use it for a 1st round shot and then would wait to reload, even if it was an action. That makes it 1.5x, 1x, 1x, would would just be a buff. The majority said giving up a whole action to reload was a non-starter.

I do also agree with those here that are saying they don't think you should have these be a Dex save. I totally know what you're going for, but plate armor was often "proofed" against bullets, showing off the dent where a bullet didn't penetrate ("bullet proofed").

If you want a mechanic that could be fun and unpredictable, you could do something like "roll 2 attack rolls, if both miss you do 0 damage, if one hits you do half damage, if both hit you do full damage, add 1 damage die for each attack that crits."