Am I using the right system?

A5e is IMO quite amenable to homebrew. I have a lot of material from other versions of 5e and other editions of D&D I've converted to Level Up.
That's great to hear! I'm going to do some diving in to the system this evening to get an idea for it. My main question is: do you feel that homebrew classes (like, for example, MCDM's Illrigger or Kibbles' Warden) ported into A5E need to be given a little more oomph to remain in line with the classes already included in the base A5E, or do they fit in pretty naturally?

We’ve been playing a Forgotten Realms game for over a year which converted from 5e to Savage Pathfinder as our GM got a bit tired of 5e monsters in particular. It’s great fun.

One of the subtle differences between Savage Worlds and D&D in general is that D&D has a resource attrition model while SWADE does not. The practical implication of this is that D&D is designed to support a series of (usually incrementally more challenging) encounters to burn off resources so that the later fights are more dramatic and challenging, but the initial counters are really just speed bumps and resource sinks. Since SWADE doesn’t have the model built in (especially wound levels versus hit points) you don’t need a lot of small fights to make the big fights interesting. The impact of this is that every fight can be an interesting one in SWADE (and conversely, running too many small fights using the full combat system will result in random character death at some point due to the exploding dice*). We tend to prefer games where there are a smaller number of significant battles, but if you want to run games with lots of combats chained together like a classic dungeon delve this can be tricky. One to be aware of when choosing.

* The solution to this is to use the Dangerous Quick Encounter rules to replace the ‘speed bump’ combats. Use these when success is basically guaranteed and the question is more ‘at what cost?’
Admittedly, the resource attrition model is one of the draws of 5e for me and part of why I don't go with SWADE as often. It's also why I have swapped out my resting rules for a blend of the Gritty Realism alternative (p. 267 in the '14 DMG) and the popular "Safe Haven" ruleset to make forays out into the wilds or to a dungeon into a tactical game as well. Under this I find my players stocking up more before the adventure; buying potions, medical supplies, extra rations, etc., while also needing to figure out how to transport a lot of it (as well as the gold and stuff they get there) so they'll usually purchase (or have) a mule or two on hand.

Boy, 1e has affected me greatly in how I run my games.

In any case, I will still give Savage Pathfinder a look because it may still scratch an itch for me without the necessity for resource attrition.
 

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That's great to hear! I'm going to do some diving in to the system this evening to get an idea for it. My main question is: do you feel that homebrew classes (like, for example, MCDM's Illrigger or Kibbles' Warden) ported into A5E need to be given a little more oomph to remain in line with the classes already included in the base A5E, or do they fit in pretty naturally?
Yes and no. A5e classes are not more powerful than, say, WotC classes, so mechanically there shouldn't be much issue in terms of balance. That being said, A5e classes do have more options, so it may feel a better fit if you're converting to look at existing A5e classes with an eye toward toward providing more choices per level, maybe even integrating some A5e innovations like combat maneuvers if appropriate.
 

That's great to hear! I'm going to do some diving in to the system this evening to get an idea for it. My main question is: do you feel that homebrew classes (like, for example, MCDM's Illrigger or Kibbles' Warden) ported into A5E need to be given a little more oomph to remain in line with the classes already included in the base A5E, or do they fit in pretty naturally?
I will say, keep your eyes peeled for even more a5e classes coming out that will fit those niches. However, in the meantime, a5r currently has 30 classes (+2 more in the next few months) between 1st and 3rd party (+7 motif classes, which are special combo classes that go up through level 8). a5e is nothing if not full of options.

As Micah Sweet said, a5e classes are not more powerful, they just have more options: especially outside of combat. While adding combat maneuvers to existing 5e classes is one way to give them more options, my opinion is that adding knacks (each class has a different name for these features, but collectively they are known as knacks) to them will make your players feel like they are getting the full experience.
 

I will say, keep your eyes peeled for even more a5e classes coming out that will fit those niches. However, in the meantime, a5r currently has 30 classes (+2 more in the next few months) between 1st and 3rd party (+7 motif classes, which are special combo classes that go up through level 8). a5e is nothing if not full of options.

As Micah Sweet said, a5e classes are not more powerful, they just have more options: especially outside of combat. While adding combat maneuvers to existing 5e classes is one way to give them more options, my opinion is that adding knacks (each class has a different name for these features, but collectively they are known as knacks) to them will make your players feel like they are getting the full experience.
Agreed. I suggested combat maneuvers both because they are a special feature of A5e and thus feel like part of that game, and because there are 5e classes out there that narratively should have access to combat maneuvers if they exist.
 

As Micah Sweet said, a5e classes are not more powerful, they just have more options: especially outside of combat
A5e Classes were designed to meet all three pillars found within an adventure. Combat, Exploration and Social Interaction.

A5e also offers up a lot of customization for your character's origin by splitting up race/species into heritage/culture for a slightly more RL feel.
 


... I will just say that I like a fair bit of crunch in my games ...
  • Bounded Accuracy....
  • Character Classes....
  • Homebrew....

From what you describe here, it's sounds like 5e or a variant like A5e really is what you want. It's the best I can think of that hits all these well.

I would think that Pathfinder 1e or a 3.5e game might be worth looking at, but it sounds like you already know that will mean tossing Bounded Accuracy out the window. They would do a good job of checking your other boxes, though.
 

Yes and no. A5e classes are not more powerful than, say, WotC classes, so mechanically there shouldn't be much issue in terms of balance. That being said, A5e classes do have more options, so it may feel a better fit if you're converting to look at existing A5e classes with an eye toward toward providing more choices per level, maybe even integrating some A5e innovations like combat maneuvers if appropriate.
I will say, keep your eyes peeled for even more a5e classes coming out that will fit those niches. However, in the meantime, a5r currently has 30 classes (+2 more in the next few months) between 1st and 3rd party (+7 motif classes, which are special combo classes that go up through level 8). a5e is nothing if not full of options.

As Micah Sweet said, a5e classes are not more powerful, they just have more options: especially outside of combat. While adding combat maneuvers to existing 5e classes is one way to give them more options, my opinion is that adding knacks (each class has a different name for these features, but collectively they are known as knacks) to them will make your players feel like they are getting the full experience.
If I do stick with 5e, combat maneuvers for martial classes (and even, to a much more limited degree, some caster classes) would be something I would look at including. But Broken Synapse makes a good point as well about social options. I've looked through A5E a little today and, while the jury is still out on if I'm a full convert (though I can certainly see myself playing a game or two in the system because it looks tight as heck), I can certainly see myself incorporating more social abilities (both active and passive) into my own games.

When thinking about it more, the idea I had was to take a look at 5e classes (both WOTC and Homebrew) and quantify how many skills each class has for combat vs. social vs. exploration and use that as a metric to decide what they all should get. In my mind I'm currently favoring a slot-based approach (again, assuming I stick with 5e as a base, which I'm not fully committed to just yet) wherein classes like a Fighter, for example, who doesn't have as many social abilities would have, say, double their proficiency bonus in "social skill slots" to use and then a menu of skills to fill those slots. Passive abilities might take up one slot, but active abilities might take up two or even three.

Admittedly I haven't given this much thought or really crunched the numbers yet outside of what is a very surface level idea. But I like the vibe of it and might look into it further.

Another thing about A5E that I enjoyed quite a bit was the way classes had multiple feature options at certain levels, allowing for additional customization on the part of the player. I don't know if that's something I'd be eager to homebrew in for 5e, but I do like that as a concept and it looks like A5E really pulls it off well without becoming overwhelming for the player (choice paralysis and all that).

A5e Classes were designed to meet all three pillars found within an adventure. Combat, Exploration and Social Interaction.

A5e also offers up a lot of customization for your character's origin by splitting up race/species into heritage/culture for a slightly more RL feel.
I am a fan of doing the heritage/culture split over race/species for multiple reasons, but certainly because it gives a more true-to-life feeling. Sadly, that's not as relevant to the type of campaign I'm planning since it's going to be heavily inspired by the likes of Wayward Children, a book series by Seanan McGuire featuring kids who are whisked off to other worlds (in the vein of Narnia, Oz, Wonderland, etc.).

My idea was to have the players all make their characters siblings who are in their early to mid 20s. The setting would be one inspired pre-great war Victorian/Edwardian era, and I could see it being that a number of the characters are either in the midst of or just finishing up their university schooling when they are invited by their uncle to stay for an indeterminant length of time at his countryside manor. It is there that they discover that not only does he have world hidden in his pantry or what have you, but there's also one in the billiards room, the dining hall, the library, etc. The players are therefore playing this "fish out of water" style for most of it, which it quite a draw for my group. I'll give them a limited amount of time to spend in each world and when they come out there's a "cooldown" and also dice rolled to determine how much time passes in their absence.

There will, of course, also be much to do outside of the various worlds, but that is all for another thread.

In any case, thank you for adding another vote for the A5E! It's certainly another system that I am curious to try out and play with some more.

From what you describe here, it's sounds like 5e or a variant like A5e really is what you want. It's the best I can think of that hits all these well.

I would think that Pathfinder 1e or a 3.5e game might be worth looking at, but it sounds like you already know that will mean tossing Bounded Accuracy out the window. They would do a good job of checking your other boxes, though.
Yeah the bounded accuracy is a big draw for me, which is why I have not stuck with either Pathfinder (although I understand PF2e has a variant that is like bounded accuracy) or 3.5e. Nevertheless, there is a lot to learn from both systems and I certainly think they do a lot of great things!
 

Yeah the bounded accuracy is a big draw for me, which is why I have not stuck with either Pathfinder (although I understand PF2e has a variant that is like bounded accuracy) or 3.5e. Nevertheless, there is a lot to learn from both systems and I certainly think they do a lot of great things!
PF2 works mechanically similar to BA, but the ceiling and basement constantly shift. Meaning at level 1 you cake walk level 0 stuff but struggle against level 3 stuff, and level 5 is impossible. Eventually, at level 3, level 1 stuff is cake walk, and now level 5 is the struggle. By level 10, the PCs cant be threatened by any number of level 1s anymore, but are still challenged by level 13 stuff, etc...

The proficiency without level variant, expands the play band a bit so its not so tight and spread out across levels, but still works similarly.
 

PF2 works mechanically similar to BA, but the ceiling and basement constantly shift. Meaning at level 1 you cake walk level 0 stuff but struggle against level 3 stuff, and level 5 is impossible. Eventually, at level 3, level 1 stuff is cake walk, and now level 5 is the struggle. By level 10, the PCs cant be threatened by any number of level 1s anymore, but are still challenged by level 13 stuff, etc...

The proficiency without level variant, expands the play band a bit so its not so tight and spread out across levels, but still works similarly.
Yeah I'm relatively familiar with that aspect of PF2e, although I've played it only a little. The people I did play with were vehemently against using the proficiency without level variant (which I can totally understand given the type of fantasy PF2e seems to be looking to convey) so alas I didn't get to try that out as much as I would have liked. But perhaps another day~

For me I like the concept of being able to just plop down a bunch of stuff (a wolf den, a bandit camp, a roaming demon or something, just as a couple of examples) at the beginning of "world creation" and just leave it there until the players stumble across it and feel confident that when they do, they (usually) won't completely steamroll it or wipe it off the face of the planet. Nor, similarly, will they be unable to escape if they run into something far out of their league.
 

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