An uncomfortable thought

[Anselyn]

For one thing, those laws (similar laws do exist in the USA, Canada and elsewhere) do not protect hobbies and people following a hobby.

I agree - but that's not the entirety of what you originally said.

I also agree that an employer who wants to get rid of you - even with protections in place - will probably find a way. They can check timekeeping down to the second, phone/internet usage etc, etc. However, from a utilitarian/economic point-of-view why would they sack a valuable employee?

I still find it hard to imagine a work environment that is so red in tooth and claw that the employees are trying to take each other out but while the employer doesn't just look at the bottom line to see who is a useful employee.

Equally, if there were two equal performers and one was put aside based on an unusual hobby then that would be unfortunate.

I should say that as an academic physicist my workplace is very geek friendly. I took the morning off to see The Force Awakens on its first day at the cinema and there I met a colleague who had taken his entire research group to the same showing.

 

[Anselyn]

Duplicate post.

 

[Umbran]

I still find it hard to imagine a work environment that is so red in tooth and claw that the employees are trying to take each other out but while the employer doesn't just look at the bottom line to see who is a useful employee.

Because everyone in the stack are *humans*, and communication is not perfect. That employer is a human, not a Vulcan, a individual human with his or her own foibles, biases, and cognitive limitations.

Communication through a corporation is not perfect. How does that employer know who is a "useful employee"? Generally not through direct personal observation, unless it is a very small business. The employer is reading status reports and evaluations. And who is *writing* those evaluations?

If you have a manager who disagrees with what they think your life choices are, they will make you look bad to the employer, and the employee probably doesn't ahve a lot of recourse most of the time.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

A gay Wiccan gamer friend of mine had some run-ins with his evangelical Christian co-worker. All I can say is that had she been his superior, the situation's resolution would have been much more difficult.

 

[Anselyn]

Because everyone in the stack are *humans*, and communication is not perfect. That employer is a human, not a Vulcan, a individual human with his or her own foibles, biases, and cognitive limitations.

Communication through a corporation is not perfect. How does that employer know who is a "useful employee"? Generally not through direct personal observation, unless it is a very small business. The employer is reading status reports and evaluations. And who is *writing* those evaluations?

If you have a manager who disagrees with what they think your life choices are, they will make you look bad to the employer, and the employee probably doesn't have a lot of recourse most of the time.

I agree this is an entirely plausible scenario for what could happen. I work in a relatively un-layered organisation so I don't know how large corporations work. However, my experience is that mostly these days governments, funding agencies and, well, the modern world love metrics and league tables. Opinions, including expert opinions, have been made secondary to stats. So, hence my gut feeling that outputs are measurable and measured. Haven't managers just got better things, and safer, things to do than make unjustified decisions based on bias.

As I said, it is entirely plausible that these things could go on. It's a good story and we're all here because we quite like stories; developing them and working with them. Now, given that we've had little evidence that this is actually happening. I just wonder if there's not a little part of the gamer psyche - in asking and answering this question - this sort of wishes this definitely did go on so we could justifiably feel ourselves to be a put-upon minority?

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Gaming- in this particular case, LARPing- is still held in enough of a negative light that it was considered by some as a campaign issue regarding the character of a candidate in a Florida election.

http://www.businessinsider.com/florida-house-candidate-defends-his-hobby-activities-2014-4

 

[Umbran]

However, my experience is that mostly these days governments, funding agencies and, well, the modern world love metrics and league tables. Opinions, including expert opinions, have been made secondary to stats.

You know that the root word of "stats" is "statistics", yes? You know that statistics call for carefully taken, and hopefully large, sample sizes, yes? So, those should not be applied to *individual* workers. At least not to your typical office worker, to whom most of this office-politics kind of thing apply.

So, hence my gut feeling that outputs are measurable and measured. Haven't managers just got better things, and safer, things to do than make unjustified decisions based on bias.

Heck, in the software industry these days, you don't measure the output of individuals - you measure teams.

And, consider that the bulk of business out there is actually *small* business. They don't have time, money, or expertise to try to come up with metrics for everything.

I have to ask, what kind of office jobs have you held? In what industries? I ask so I can perhaps understand your perspective better, and be better able to explain.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

And, consider that the bulk of business out there is actually *small* business. They don't have time, money, or expertise to try to come up with metrics for everything.

I have to ask, what kind of office jobs have you held? In what industries?

If you're the oddball in a company with a total workforce of 10 people, if what makes you stand out is not beloved by the boss, you're probably one mistake from being tossed, unless you are The Guy.

 

[Wednesday Boy]

For example, imagine a person who has a job that requires a government security clearance. Now, imagine pictures of them in live-action RPG costumes getting put up and tagged on Facebook.

My gamer friend has a Government security clearance and he said this sort of thing has no impact on obtaining or maintaining his security clearance. His organization doesn't judge their personnel's hobbies as long as they don't involve the overthrow of the Government (I presume a Rebel Alliance LARP would be fine.) or make them a security risk. Pictures of him gambling in Vegas (a more common pastime) would concern them more than dressing up as an elf. Obviously this is anecdotal, all organizations are different, and if someone has a beef with you they can twist gaming or anything else to further their agenda.

 

[TarionzCousin]

While there were plenty of reasons for Sen. David Wu to step down, and there is no hint that he ever played an RPG or LARPed in his life, none of that will stop people from making false equivalences between his actions, this photo, and our hobby.

He really didn't do us any favors.

David Wu had several allegations of sexual impropriety (and worse) against him. Luckily, as the article points out, he was from Oregon so many people didn't notice the picture/scandal. I've lived in Oregon most of my life and I didn't remember this until I read the article.

Jian Ghomeshi's recent trial is relevant here. He was an extremely popular host of the most popular Canadian radio program when some of his former sexual partners accused him of various things. He was recently found not guilty, but don't expect him to get his old job back anytime soon!

More here: http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/25/world/jian-ghomeshi-verdict-canada-feat/