And the mystery race is...hated

[Stone Dog]

Given that we know you get racial powers as you advance in level, and they're called Dragonborn, you can bet your bottom dollar they'll be flying around and breathing fire.

Granted that this is a way I expect them to go. However, if racial talents are as modular as I'm hoping that there are other options to make them more lizardy and not as dragony.

I've never banned a single thing from a PHB. I'd hate to start now, but this might be it. 4e is sounding more and more like the 10% of stuff I don't care much for is actually waterchestnuts and I'll have to pick them out. It doesn't all have to be delicious, but I'm a little turned off by how much I don't think is actually palatable.

They've changed Tiefling background info

So tieflings aren't humans with fiendish ancestry anymore?

 

[Rechan]

Granted that this is a way I expect them to go. However, if racial talents are as modular as I'm hoping that there are other options to make them more lizardy and not as dragony.

"Lizardy" just probably can't compete at higher levels. We know that dwarves are getting dwarfy abilities that click well with the fighter, as indicated by someone mentioning a fighter taking the "Touch with the Earth" or somethinglikethat ability.

So tieflings aren't humans with fiendish ancestry anymore?

It's been said there was an "ancient tiefling empire that dealt with consorting with devils" or something. I'm willing to put money on Tiefs "breeding true", as their own race, rather than just 10,000 "My great grandfather was a pit fiend."

 

[Mad Mac]

A lot is going to depend on the fluff. All we really have to go by at this point is a name and rough physical description. They made Tieflings into a true-breeding race with history and culture after all. They got their own weapon designs, even. I'd be shocked if they don't do something similar with dragonborne.

As far as comparing them to Lizardmen, it occurs to me that Wizards has kind of been neglecting classic lizardfolk for a while now. There are precious few actual Lizardfolk mini's out there, for instance. They don't show up in modules much either, probably because they make poor antagonists. They're neutral, and so almost always get a sympathetic potrayal that lends itself more to diplomacy than swordplay. (This rule holds true even in most of the D&D based video games I can think of.)

On the other hand, they aren't well suited to being player characters either, so they end up being mostly background material. I can see a well done dragonborne race as mostly supplanting lizardmen as the ambiguously aligned lizard-race that can be either friend or foe. Eberron already depicts lizardmen with a vauge draconic connection. "Blackscale" lizardfolk are the chosen servants of a Black dragon who happen to have acid resistance, for example...The Dragonshard RTS game (which flopped, but had to get all their fluff approved) had an entire faction of dragon reverencing lizardmen, including two champions who had overt dragon characteristics.

Trogs on the other hand have gotten quite a bit of love in the last few years. I can see Wizards continuing to push them as the evil lizard-race players should have no qualms about fighting.

 

[Merlin the Tuna]

If dragons only fit a theme of being evil creatures, or that they're rare beings who never had much contact with the common races, or "no one has ever seen a dragon", then I've got to eliminate Dragonborn as a PHB choice.

This is actually the big reason I've given the announcement a warmer reception than my usual response to yet-another-bloody-dragon-thing. I want to see dragons be a bit more common, a bit more likely to be just hanging around in caves being angry lizards. If there's one trend in fantasy that bugs me, it's the tendency to make dragons the place that nerds go to masturbate. The dragon is always extremely old, wise, all-knowing, super-holographic-rare, mysterious, and the most powerful thing this side of Elminster. Introducing a dragon offshoot in the PHB actually takes them down a peg, making them ever-so-slightly more mundane, as well as giving the scales a nice bit of visibility in the game that's named after them.

And I for one don't expect 100% usability out of the PHB. When I began putting my campaign world together, I chucked 4 of the PHB base classes, overhauled a couple of the others, and urged players to draw as much as possible from supplements like ToB, PHB2, and XPH. The PHB races fared only marginally better. As supplements come out for 4E, I expect a similar thing will happen, though hopefully on a considerably smaller scale.

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

I'll chime in on the side of Uggh! for this one. Most of the flavor changes I've heard of in 4e I've rather liked (though the points of light article was a notable exception). I could use less freakish PCs not more and anticipate this race being banned in all of my campaigns from the get-go.

Worse yet, it means we're likely to get a horde of ugly dragonborn miniatures in the next few sets that will have pretty much zero relevance to any setting that is not core 4.0, Elsir Vale (where they could sub for spawn of Tiamat--not that it matters since most people who will play it have already played Red Hand of Doom) or Dragonlance (where, depending upon their appearance, they may be able to sub in for Draconians).

 

[pawsplay]

Too much Bahamut. Unless they are seriously retooled, I have a hard time seeing them as a major player race, unless great wars between dragons is going to be a major theme in the new edition.

 

[CleverNickName]

Sounds...interesting. I mean, I'm not thrilled about their choice, given all that they could have gone with. But dragonborn doesn't sound like it will be the end of D&D as we know it.

That was what the Warforged were created for. (rimshot)

Seriously though. I didn't have a problem with sorcerers getting their arcane magic from the bloodline of dragons, and I didn't really have a problem with the Dragon Disciple prestige class, and I really didn't have a problem with the Dragonborn race in 3.5E. It's sort of surprising, but at least it is a DRAGON class... I was getting so sick of demons and elves.

 

[Dave Turner]

I think it's a fine choice. I'm thrilled that gnomes aren't in the first PHB. They've been a largely redundant race throughout the game's history. Unlike Henry, I've always leaned towards banning gnomes in a game I run. So this might be the first time that I run a D&D game with all the PHB options turned on!

 

[rounser]

Just a random thought: If WOTC did some survey, and found the "people like playing half-dragons", couldn't that just be munchkinism?

If they're a core race now with no kewl powerz (to go with one's phat lewtz, of course) like high strength scores and breathe weapons, then this all might be in vain. Just some munchkin flash in the pan from 3E that now every campaign will have to wear.

I bet people liked playing those demonic super elves too - so hello tieflings and eladrin.

These things are like the "psionics of races" - they're cool precisely because they're different and rare, and not mainstream fare.

 

[BlackMoria]

Marvelous. I was hoping they would tone down the 'Freak Show' syndrome in 4e. Now Dragonborn can join Tieflings as 'core' freaks instead of supplement book freaks. Give me the misunderstood and abused gnomes any day. At least gnomes are conceptually palatable in a wider range of campaign settings (Dragonlance, FR, Greyhawk, etc.)

*Sigh*