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[Wayside]

You can call it a "guess" all you want, but it ain't necessarily so. Tara said it WAS the above, she wasn't making a hypothesis.

It definitely came off as Tara trying to console Buffy, and just offering her a possible explanation. The real reason we never hear about, anymore than we hear about what exactly made the Slayer line vulnerable to the First.

And yes, I know he had some kind of puppy dog affection for her before she died, but I don't think it was real love. Look how they treated each other when they did get together. That was one twisted, abusive relationship. My point is that Spike knew that without a soul he couldn't really love the way he knew Buffy needed. He literally wasn't capable of it. That's why he got a soul.

You know, this is another thing that seemed odd to me. When Spike went off in a huff it sure seemed like he was trying to get rid of the chip so he could kick some ass. When he completes all the trials and gets his soul he looks surprised. I guess the writers changed their minds mid-stride? In season 7 everything said about it leads us to believe he went after his soul for Buffy.

Remember, the whole time before he had a soul, he was also under the power of the restraining brain chip. Unable to victimize people, he wrapped his life around the one person he could still hurt: Buffy. His "love" for Buffy wasn't real, and he knew it, but he wanted it to be real all the same. That's why he fought to get his soul back.

This is what I was responding too. Not arguing that in the end Spike is supposed to have gone after his soul specifically to be better for Buffy. Just that he loved Buffy before he realized he could hurt her. I won't argue against any idea of 'real' love v. 'fake' love . In the Buffyverse I'm sure that distinction is meant to exist, which is all we need to know. I definitely agree that Spike is the better character.

 

[Severion]

I was never under the impression that Spike "Worked for his soul". I mean he did work for it, but i don't think that was his intention. He was pissed and wanted to "Give her what she deserves". The problem was he just happened to be what what she deserved.

As for Angel missing out on the reward for using the amulet, my wife had a theory. Spike "earned" his soul, Angels soul is a curse and therefore tainted. It may not have worked.

 

[CCamfield]

I was never under the impression that Spike "Worked for his soul". I mean he did work for it, but i don't think that was his intention. He was pissed and wanted to "Give her what she deserves". The problem was he just happened to be what what she deserved.

That's what I thought at first, but stuff he said in 7th season definitely contradicted it. The speech about how a bloke had to do what was right for his woman, or whatever. I think it was in the episode which ended with him leaning against a cross and sizzling.

 

[Wayside]

That's what I thought at first, but stuff he said in 7th season definitely contradicted it. The speech about how a bloke had to do what was right for his woman, or whatever. I think it was in the episode which ended with him leaning against a cross and sizzling.

Man that was a great image, draping himself over that cross.

 

[John Crichton]

I was never under the impression that Spike "Worked for his soul". I mean he did work for it, but i don't think that was his intention. He was pissed and wanted to "Give her what she deserves". The problem was he just happened to be what what she deserved.

This is exactly it. He was looking to shut off the chip so he could go to town on Buffy's friends and her. I believe he lied about all that chiviry stuff. Makes it more interesting to me, anyway.

 

[Taluron]

My take on SPike getting his soul back (when he got it) is that he got what he asked for. Not necessarily what he wanted but what he asked for. Something like "give me what I need to give the slayer what she deserves". What HE thought she deserved and what the universe at large (or even the creature who tested him) thought she deserves do not have to be the same.

 

[Welverin]

Didn't ask to be what he was before?

Quick someone go look it up!

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

This is exactly it. He was looking to shut off the chip so he could go to town on Buffy's friends and her. I believe he lied about all that chiviry stuff. Makes it more interesting to me, anyway.

He may have been thinking that on some level, but don't forget that Spike has always been a softy at heart, whether as vampire or human. Remember how he was all set to blow Buffy away with a shotgun, but instantly changed when he saw she was crying (due to Joyce's illness)? Spike was always massively conflicted about his feelings for Buffy.

 

[John Crichton]

He may have been thinking that on some level, but don't forget that Spike has always been a softy at heart, whether as vampire or human. Remember how he was all set to blow Buffy away with a shotgun, but instantly changed when he saw she was crying (due to Joyce's illness)? Spike was always massively conflicted about his feelings for Buffy.

He was conflicted and I am more than willing to admit his soft spot for Buffy, but at that point they were building the story to make it look like Spike was shaping up to be the Big Bad for the next season. He was scorned, hurt and dead focused on getting back at Buffy. He didn't go through those trials to get his soul back, he did it because he was a jilted lover who's words got twisted around. Just so happened that it worked out for him. Don't forget that he used to kill slayers for fun and enjoyed every second of it.

 

[Tarrasque Wrangler]

Nothing Spike did or said in the last season implied to me that he went to Africa to do anything but get a soul. You can say he was lying to Buffy if you want, but there was nothing in the storyline to suggest that. By that rationale, I could say he went to Africa to buy a nice bouquet of African flowers from that demon guy to give to Buffy, which she also would have deserved.

I think Joss put one over on you all big time. I know I was surprised at the end of the 6th season finale, but not so much "WTF?!?!?!?" as "A-ha!".