Any Way to Get Away When Prone?

[melkorspawn]

This is limited, but how about the Thief-Acrobat's 'Kip Up'?

 

[Arabesu]

Stand up

I am not sure that the situation that Ogrork the Mighty was suggested should ever happen:

"...try to get up (provoking an AoO) just to get knocked back down again (and suffer an extra attack from Trip)."

... because the AoO comes when you are still technically prone and trying to get up. Thus if one is already prone, they can't be retripped. It is, as I see it, just like the leaving of a particular square provoking an AoO, rather than the entering of another square that provokes an AoO from movement.

So if prone, stand up. Sure the oppenent gets a free swing, but then unless you've been killed or knocked unconscious, you've successfully risen up and can smack them back. The only problem comes if the opponent has either "large and in charge" or "stand still," in which case I'd suspect they could potentially keep you prone indefinitely.

At least this is the way we are playing it my DM's game. If it works the other way round, then my tripping monk will be mega-pleased.

Arabesu

 

[Enkhidu]

If Grog doesn’t damage Bob, Bob’s initial touch attack
would suffer a –4 penalty for being prone. If the grab succeeds,
Bob is still prone and still suffers the –4 penalty for being
prone for the ensuing opposed grapple check. (Some DMs I
know would give Bob an offsetting bonus for being able to
wrap himself around Grog’s ankles, but I don’t recommend
doing so; it’s pretty easy to kick loose from somebody lying on
the ground when you’re standing up).

You know, when I see this, I don't think it jives with what the SRD says about what a grapple check entails:

Base attack bonus + Strength modifier + special size modifier

I don't see any other mods in there.

 

[Legildur]

You know, when I see this, I don't think it jives with what the SRD says about what a grapple check entails: ....
I don't see any other mods in there.

Which is why, I guess, that Hypersmurf qualified his quote from the SRD with 'if one considers the FAQ authoritative'.

 

[Hypersmurf]

You know, when I see this, I don't think it jives with what the SRD says about what a grapple check entails:

I don't see any other mods in there.

Well, come to that:

Your attack bonus with a melee weapon is:
Base attack bonus + Strength modifier + size modifier

The paragraph above that states:
When you make an attack roll, you roll a d20 and add your attack bonus. (Other modifiers may also apply to this roll.)

On the other hand, it does note that:
A grapple check is like a melee attack roll. Your attack bonus on a grapple check is:
Base attack bonus + Strength modifier + special size modifier

So, a melee attack roll is d20 + attack bonus + other modifiers.
A grapple check is like a melee attack roll, with the caveat that the attack bonus is different.

I can see how it can be argued that 'other modifiers' applicable to melee attack rolls are applicable to something that is 'like an attack roll'.

After all, nothing in the definition of 'opposed grapple check' in the Grappling section states 'roll a d20'. The only way to determine that a d20 is required is to note that it is 'like a melee attack roll', which requires you to roll a d20 before adding your attack bonus and other modifiers.

-Hyp.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I am not sure that the situation that Ogrork the Mighty was suggested should ever happen:

"...try to get up (provoking an AoO) just to get knocked back down again (and suffer an extra attack from Trip)."

I don't think he meant that the AoO knocks you back down.

He means you get up, provoking an AoO... and the very first thing the opponent does on his next turn is trip you again.

-Hyp.

 

[Elephant]

It's not a 5' step; it's crawling five feet as a move action that provokes an AoO.

From the Actions in Combat section of the PHB:
Crawling: You can crawl 5 feet as a move action. Crawling incurs attacks of opportunity from any attackers who threaten you at any point of your crawl.

-Hyp.

Where did I say anything about a 5' step? I asked about a 5' move.

Thanks for the quote, though

 

[Enkhidu]

Well, come to that:

Your attack bonus with a melee weapon is:
Base attack bonus + Strength modifier + size modifier

The paragraph above that states:
When you make an attack roll, you roll a d20 and add your attack bonus. (Other modifiers may also apply to this roll.)

On the other hand, it does note that:
A grapple check is like a melee attack roll. Your attack bonus on a grapple check is:
Base attack bonus + Strength modifier + special size modifier

So, a melee attack roll is d20 + attack bonus + other modifiers.
A grapple check is like a melee attack roll, with the caveat that the attack bonus is different.

I can see how it can be argued that 'other modifiers' applicable to melee attack rolls are applicable to something that is 'like an attack roll'.

After all, nothing in the definition of 'opposed grapple check' in the Grappling section states 'roll a d20'. The only way to determine that a d20 is required is to note that it is 'like a melee attack roll', which requires you to roll a d20 before adding your attack bonus and other modifiers.

-Hyp.

I can see where you're coming from on this (I've already been down this road in coinversations at our gaming table - I argued your position for a while), but I think you can also say that the phrase "like an attack roll" also simply means there's both BAB and a d20 involved.

Something I noticed from the FAQ's entry is that if prone modifiers are to be included in a grapple, the other modifiers can come into play as well - and I'm not so sure that I'm ready for Aid Another actions in a grapple to allow for large numbers of creatures to pretty much auto-grapple PCs.

 

[Infiniti2000]

...but I think you can also say that the phrase "like an attack roll" also simply means there's both BAB and a d20 involved.

I don't agree that one can argue that position. You either apply all factors of "like an attack roll" (including the d20 and other modifiers) or none of them. You can't selectively choose which you want to apply. Or, rather, you can do whatever you want, but you know what I mean by "can't".

 

[Ogrork the Mighty]

I don't think he meant that the AoO knocks you back down.

He means you get up, provoking an AoO... and the very first thing the opponent does on his next turn is trip you again.

-Hyp.

Exactly.