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D&D 5E Anyone using spell points from the DMG?

vivsavage

Explorer
I'm curious as to how well they worked for you, especially at higher levels. BONUS: what do you think of – instead of spell slots or spell points – using a spellcasting roll to see if a spell works or not?
 
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Bolares

Hero
I've always wanted to try them.... but in the end my players weren't interested in the extra bit of math.

I think they give you more flexibility, but may change the balance of encounters if the players jus send 5th level spell after 5th level spell all day.
 




Yaarel

Mind Mage
Regarding the math of the spell points, defacto, there is no "gap" between slot 2 and slot 3. There are some very powerful level 2 spells and some very subpar slot 3 spells. Thus there is a seemless continuum from 1 to 5.

Recalculate the spell points available according to the following values

Slot 1: 2 points
Slot 2: 3 points
Slot 3: 4 points
Slot 4: 5 points
Slot 5: 6 points

The higher slots are treated separately.

I actually only use points for slots 1 to 5. For slots 6 to 9, the game system treats them separately, and I just use the regular per-day slots for them. This also avoids spamming the spells of slots 6 to 9.

A character can spend 1 point to cast an unknown/unprepared cantrip.
 


Oofta

Title? I don't need no stinkin' title.
Whatever you do, don't ever use it for the Warlock. According to the DMG, the Universe will legit imploded if done.

And then your Patron's credit card get declined when they go to Red Lobster for dinner.
That's a bad thing because ... why?
 


I've always wanted to try them.... but in the end my players weren't interested in the extra bit of math.

I think they give you more flexibility, but may change the balance of encounters if the players jus send 5th level spell after 5th level spell all day.
The big issue is using it outside of the 6-8 encounters per day. This lets a character "nova" every combat, since they just don't care about low level spells. With extended encounters, they will have to fall back on cantrips much quicker if they do this.
 

Oofta

Title? I don't need no stinkin' title.
The big issue is using it outside of the 6-8 encounters per day. This lets a character "nova" every combat, since they just don't care about low level spells. With extended encounters, they will have to fall back on cantrips much quicker if they do this.
It would be interesting if you could adjust the spell points to match up with number of expected encounters. So standard number if you generally do 6-8, significantly less if you do less. Maybe tie that with everyone getting some spell points back during a short rest or even "mana potions".

It would require a fair bit of play-testing though, along with guidance of the style of game you want. Some people might be perfectly fine with casters going nova every encounter, others want a low magic campaign that this could support.
 
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Ancalagon

Dusty Dragon
The big issue is using it outside of the 6-8 encounters per day. This lets a character "nova" every combat, since they just don't care about low level spells. With extended encounters, they will have to fall back on cantrips much quicker if they do this.
I think that's less likely in 5e than in previous editions. The reason why is because low level spells are more valuable. It used to be in 3e that the spell DC was linked to the spell level - so a low level debuff/control spell quickly loses utility. In 5e, low level damage spells don't scale well (just cantrip!) but there are spells that stay useful for a long time - misty step, invisibility, healing word, shield, mirror image (I'm sure I'm forgetting quite a few!).... so you definitely want to keep some low level slots in your pocket.

Of course, if the GM runs a 1 fight/day game, magic point is going to be imbalanced... but the game already is imbalanced anyway.
 
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Bolares

Hero
Isn't there already a rule that with spell points, even if youhave the points to cast them, you can only cast one of each of the 6+ level spells per day? If taht's the case, how would you manage that information, to make everyone remember wich spells have already been cast?
 

Savage Wombat

Adventurer
Isn't there already a rule that with spell points, even if youhave the points to cast them, you can only cast one of each of the 6+ level spells per day? If taht's the case, how would you manage that information, to make everyone remember wich spells have already been cast?
Yes, and I guess you just have to trust the player, just as you trust them to mark off the correct number of spell points used.
 


Ath-kethin

Elder Thing
I'm curious as to how well they worked for you, especially at higher levels. BONUS: what do you think of – instead of spell slots or spell points – using a spellcasting roll to see if a spell works or not?
I've never used the spell points, but I very much like a spell check to cast spells. I've never tried it in 5e, but it's a core aspect of Dungeon Crawl Classics and is a great part of the game.

I suppose a similar mechanic could work in D&D easily enough, but part of the DCC system is a table for each spell, which the caster rolls on when they cast it. Depending on the results of the check, the spell may or may not be lost in the casting - that is, in D&D terms, the spell might not actually use up a spell slot if the caster rolls high enough.

The tables in DCC have a bunch of other results too, but if you wanted to do something similar in 5e you might just have a successful check result in casting the spell and a very successful check - beating the DC by 5 or more, day - results in a successful casting that doesn't use a spell slot.

That could help counter the fact that the spells have become so much less reliable than they sued to be (since.theres now a roll instead of the normal automatic casting).
 

vincegetorix

Jewel of the North
The best way to do ''spell check'' in 5e is to ask for an ability check depending on the caster:
Bard - Perform
Sorcerer, Wizard, EK, AT - Arcana
Druid - Nature
Cleric - Religion (or Insight if you use god-less clerics)

Give them proficiency in said skill at 1st level.

Casters must make said ability checks against a DC of 10 + spell level. Cantrip are freebies.

On a failed check, roll on the Magical Scrolls Mishap from the DMG p 140

Scroll Mishap
d6Result
1A surge of magical energy deals the caster 1d6 force damage per level of the spell.
2The spell affects the caster or an ally (determined randomly) instead of the intended target, or it affects a random target nearby if the caster was the intended target.
3The spell affects a random location within the spell's range.
4The spell's effect is contrary to its normal one, but neither harmful nor beneficial. For instance, a fireball might produce an area of harmless cold.
5The caster suffers a minor but bizarre effect related to the spell. Such effects last only as long as the original spell's duration, or 1d10 minutes for spells that take effect instantaneously. For example, a fireball might cause smoke to billow from the caster's ears for 1d10 minutes.
6The spell activates after 1d12 hours. If the caster was the intended target, the spell takes effect normally. If the caster was not the intended target, the spell goes off in the general direction of the intended target, up to the spell 's maximum range, if the target has moved away.
 

Charlaquin

Goblin Queen
Whatever you do, don't ever use it for the Warlock. According to the DMG, the Universe will legit imploded if done.
I disagree. You just need to give them a different spell point progression.

LevelPoints
12
24
36
46
58
68
712
812
914
1014
1121
1221
1321
1421
1521
1621
1728
1828
1928
2028

That gets you the same output as the default warlock if you always cast at the highest level you can, and gives warlocks the ability to cast at lower levels if they want to, which might help them out especially in games where you can’t reliably get the expected number of short rests.
 

Magister Ludorum

Adventurer
Yep, just for sorcerers, adding their sorcery points to the total.

It makes the sorcerer more distinct. Being able to spam Shield and other nice 1st level spells is a great power boost.

This is the rule in my game as well. It works well for us. My players don't give a darn about party balance and don't care if the sorcerer can cast a lot of higher level spells by giving up casting lower level spells. If the sorcerer runs out of spell points, they also don't pity him when he's reduced to casting cantrips in later encounter.
 

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