AoO with Spell-like abilities

[Li Shenron]

Since an AoO is nothing but a melee attack I suppose that you can't cast a touch spell and discharge it with an attack as an AoO, but you can touch-attack with it if you have cast it previously, is it correct?

If you have a spell-like ability which you activate as a free action but then use it as a touch attack, can you use it as an AoO?

These questions came up last session, when we were fighting clerics with the Death Touch (from Death domain), which is a spell-like ability and works like a touch attack. Also I had cast Inflict Light Wounds, missed the first touch attack and therefore I still had the spell "on my hand": before my next turn I got an AoO and our DM let me use the ILW touch attack with it, and I think he was right.

BTW, if an AoO action provokes an AoO itself, how do you handle the situation?

 

[shilsen]

Since an AoO is nothing but a melee attack I suppose that you can't cast a touch spell and discharge it with an attack as an AoO, but you can touch-attack with it if you have cast it previously, is it correct?

Correct.

If you have a spell-like ability which you activate as a free action but then use it as a touch attack, can you use it as an AoO?

As long as you are already threatening the area around you and can take an AoO, you would be able to do this, just like you can quick draw a weapon and use it for an AoO.

These questions came up last session, when we were fighting clerics with the Death Touch (from Death domain), which is a spell-like ability and works like a touch attack. Also I had cast Inflict Light Wounds, missed the first touch attack and therefore I still had the spell "on my hand": before my next turn I got an AoO and our DM let me use the ILW touch attack with it, and I think he was right.

Yes, he was.

BTW, if an AoO action provokes an AoO itself, how do you handle the situation?

We have the second AoO resolved before the first, even if the second is an action that provokes an AoO itself (since that can continue indefinitely).

 

[Li Shenron]

As long as you are already threatening the area around you and can take an AoO, you would be able to do this, just like you can quick draw a weapon and use it for an AoO.

Sure? I thought you can't quick-draw: I thought you can't do anything else that a single attack during an AoO. And if you have to draw a weapon, you are not threatening anyone with it (although you are threatening with your unarmed strike).

We have the second AoO resolved before the first, even if the second is an action that provokes an AoO itself (since that can continue indefinitely). [/QUOTE]

If I try to disarm, I provoke an AoO: the enemy as an AoO he tries to disarm me, does he provoke AoO on me? But then if I take my AoO and attack him normally, I am not disarming him anymore and he shouldn't have taken his AoO-provoking AoO...

 

[Kae'Yoss]

As long as you are already threatening the area around you and can take an AoO, you would be able to do this, just like you can quick draw a weapon and use it for an AoO.

I'm not so sure about this.

But there are feats out there that allow spells for AoO's (Touch spells only, I think).

 

[shilsen]

Sure? I thought you can't quick-draw: I thought you can't do anything else that a single attack during an AoO. And if you have to draw a weapon, you are not threatening anyone with it (although you are threatening with your unarmed strike).

I don't have my books on me right now, so I can't give a reference, but I think you can take a free action at the same time. What I meant was a situation like when a fighter is holding a dagger (thus threatening an area) and someone incurs an AoO. He has Quick Draw and prefers to use his longsword, so he lets go the dagger, quick draws the longsword and attacks. I could be wrong.

If I try to disarm, I provoke an AoO: the enemy as an AoO he tries to disarm me, does he provoke AoO on me? But then if I take my AoO and attack him normally, I am not disarming him anymore and he shouldn't have taken his AoO-provoking AoO...

That's what I meant by it going on indefinitely. To save time and effort, we simply allow the first one on each side. So in the above case, if Ftr1 tries to disarm Ftr2 and Ftr2 responds by trying to disarm Ftr1, then Ftr1 gets an AoO. And whatever it is, even if it is another disarm attempt, we just resolve it without allowing any more AoOs. That's not playing strictly by the rules, of course.

 

[Stalker0]

It cannot go on indefinately because you are only allowed one AOO per opponent per round.

So 1 disarms 2 provokes AOO. 2 uses AOO to disarm 1, provokes AOO. 1 uses AOO to disarm, provokes AOO. 2 has already used AOO, so he doesn't get an additional attack. So 1 does the latest disarm, then 2 gets his disarm, and then 1 gets his first disarm. This is by the book, but its perfectly fine to use house rules on this one because its obvious from this example how complicated it can get.

 

[IceBear]

The PHB implies that you would threaten the area around you with a touch spell, and delivering a touch spell itself does *not* provoke an AoO.

IceBear

 

[Li Shenron]

The PHB implies that you would threaten the area around you with a touch spell, and delivering a touch spell itself does *not* provoke an AoO.

IceBear

That's right, IceBear, if you have it already cast (but not discharged). But I think that CASTING that spell would provoke AoO, even if it takes a standard action to both cast+attack, it's still casting; and if you have not cast it before the AoO, you don't have it ready and you can't use it as an AoO.

 

[0-hr]

If you allow free actions (like Quick Draw) along with any AoO, you are asking for trouble. You are saying that if someone tries to cast a spell (or shoot a bow, or drink a potion, etc.) next to me when it is not my turn then I may get to do any (or all) of the following in addition to my attack:

drop anything I am holding
draw a couple of weapons
drop prone
cast a quickened spell
give a command to my pet
prepare an item from my Haversack or potion belt
change the facing of my Shield spell
dismiss my Tree Shape
activate my Chameleon Power ring for a +15 Hide bonus
blah blah blah

That just seems a bit much to me. The number of free actions that can be combined with another action is up to the DM. I would recommend that the DM set this number to zero when taking attacks of opportunity.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Also, free actions are still actions and these can only be taken on your own turn (a barbarian cannot enter his rage when it's not his turn, either).