Apotheosis and clergy -- what would you do?

[CRGreathouse]

How would you handle this situation as DM?

A powerful creature desires divinity. It has few followers, but they're powerful. (Gaining godhood is possible in my campaign -- the PCs know of several ascended deities.)

One of the PCs is converted to the worship of this proto-deity, and being the pius man that he is*, he decided to take his next level in cleric.

"You realize that you won't get any spells, right?" I said.

"Yeah, I know. That's fine. Someone has to be first, right?" the player said.

This campaign has been going on for years realtime, and the character is now a Clr1/Rog18.

What, if anything, should I do to keep the player in line (powerwise) with everyone else? He intends to take the next two or three levels, at least, in cleric.

Also, any thoughts about the ascention?

* He's NE and never cared for anyone else before in his entire life. The creature is also NE, though, and they share a particular outlook on life...

 

[Saeviomagy]

How would you handle this situation as DM?

A powerful creature desires divinity. It has few followers, but they're powerful. (Gaining godhood is possible in my campaign -- the PCs know of several ascended deities.)

One of the PCs is converted to the worship of this proto-deity, and being the pius man that he is*, he decided to take his next level in cleric.

"You realize that you won't get any spells, right?" I said.

"Yeah, I know. That's fine. Someone has to be first, right?" the player said.

This campaign has been going on for years realtime, and the character is now a Clr1/Rog18.

What, if anything, should I do to keep the player in line (powerwise) with everyone else? He intends to take the next two or three levels, at least, in cleric.

Also, any thoughts about the ascention?

* He's NE and never cared for anyone else before in his entire life. The creature is also NE, though, and they share a particular outlook on life...

If the creature is truely powerful, then it can probably do favours for him instead of granting him spells.

Like give him some minor magical items (which incidentally duplicate magical spells) or cast spells for him.

Or even research an improved version of scry which only works on a willing target, but lasts for 24 hrs and allows the casting of ANY beneficial spell on the subject (ie - your guy would get only buffing magic).

 

[Olive]

I wouldn't worry too much to be honest. I think it's awesome that a player would do this.

If the near deity is almost divine, maybe they already ahve domain powers to give out, just not the spells. Mayeb that would soften the blow.

 

[CRGreathouse]

If the creature is truely powerful, then it can probably do favours for him instead of granting him spells.

Like give him some minor magical items (which incidentally duplicate magical spells) or cast spells for him.

Or even research an improved version of scry which only works on a willing target, but lasts for 24 hrs and allows the casting of ANY beneficial spell on the subject (ie - your guy would get only buffing magic).

I really like these suggestions. Thanks! The creature is a spellcaster (as a 32nd-level wizard), so the long-term buffs could work. I also like the idea of giving out minor items -- it has quite a hoard...

I wouldn't worry too much to be honest. I think it's awesome that a player would do this.

If the near deity is almost divine, maybe they already ahve domain powers to give out, just not the spells. Mayeb that would soften the blow.

I think it's great. I was very pleased that he'd do this.

I want to give out domain powers, but his cult's very small now... great personal power notwithstanding, he'll need more worshippers before I could justify that (to myself).

I'll do that if he can scrounge up some other worshippers, though.

 

[Victim]

Well, the creature eventually gains the ability to grant divine spells, so the PC gets his spells.

The creature has few other worshippers (limited divine powers), so each one is more important. Therefore the character can expect some proto-divine aid at times. Whether it be buffing spells as mentioned above, True Res upon death, or whatever.

 

[Drakmar]

well... if the player manages to get some more followers.. he may start to be granted level 0 spells....

The other way that the Proto-Diety could assist is with giving aid with information. Ie.. there is a cool magic item that will help in the quest you are doing over there. Or... They have 35 warriors and they have had time to dig in. That kind of thing.

The godling would of course be trying to get such a powerful follower to help promote his religion/cult/following so that it becomes a god. And even if the player is a low level cleric of this religion, if it can in some way be shown that the god has power (whether or not it can actually grant them yet) will help gain followers. And because they believe that he can grant powers, the godling will be able to.

 

[Simplicity]

Wasn't there some rule about "godless" clerics being able to cast up to 2nd-level
spells themselves? Or am I just making that up?

 

[Hypersmurf]

Wasn't there some rule about "godless" clerics being able to cast up to 2nd-level
spells themselves? Or am I just making that up?

Sounds familiar from 1E. 1st and 2nd level spells essentially came from the Cleric's meditations and piety. 3rd through... 5th? were granted by the god's intermediaries and divine servants, and the 6th-7th level spells came straight from the Big Guy.

There was also a limit on what level spells certain gods could grant - I think demigods could only go up to 5th, and lesser gods only up to 6th. You needed a greater god for 7th level spells.

So a cleric transported to a plane where his god had no influence, for example, was limited to 1st and 2nd.

In 3E, though, a cleric can get 9th level spells through devotion to a concept... he doesn't need an affiliation to a god at all.

-Hyp.

 

[CRGreathouse]

In 3E, though, a cleric can get 9th level spells through devotion to a concept... he doesn't need an affiliation to a god at all.

Oh yes... but in my campaign, I've clarified the concept of abstract worship: there's a limited list of concepts that a cleric can worship and get spells. The creature isn't on that list.

 

[LGodamus]

You could allow him to perform special rituals to get spells...or maybe be able to prepare spells only in that creatures precense...but I personally wouldnt deny him the spells...just make him work for em