Arcane spell failure outmoded ?
- Thread starter satori01
- Start date
Nail
First Post
ASF isn't just a sacred cow. It's a balancing factor and a flavor factor. Most fantasy games do not visualize the wizard archetype to be marching around in full plate.
More over, the armor feats are not sequential....that is you could just take the heavy armor feat withou the others. If you decide to rule that with the feat, casters can forgo ASF.....one feat and some magical armor later, and they're rocking the block.
Then the mage also casts shield, haste, displacement, etc...
Sure, the mage should try to get a high AC. But come on, guys. Don't make it easy for 'im. He's enough of a pain in the @$$ already....
More over, the armor feats are not sequential....that is you could just take the heavy armor feat withou the others. If you decide to rule that with the feat, casters can forgo ASF.....one feat and some magical armor later, and they're rocking the block.
Then the mage also casts shield, haste, displacement, etc...
Sure, the mage should try to get a high AC. But come on, guys. Don't make it easy for 'im. He's enough of a pain in the @$$ already....
I don't mind wizards in full plate, few would have the str to get away without encumbrance.
I just worry about the ftr/wiz, ftr/rog, clr/wiz, etc. ASF was a nice mechanic in that it opened the door, however I don't think we need the door anymore.
Balance a psywar vs a sor/ftr. Is ASF really necessary (except, as I said earlier, for very high level spells)?
Technik
I just worry about the ftr/wiz, ftr/rog, clr/wiz, etc. ASF was a nice mechanic in that it opened the door, however I don't think we need the door anymore.
Balance a psywar vs a sor/ftr. Is ASF really necessary (except, as I said earlier, for very high level spells)?
Technik
I like Arcane Spell Failure.
However, I think the way it is actually implemented in 3e is a sacred cow and needs to be removed.
We have a wonderful method for distractions in the Concentration skill. Or even use Spellcraft or Knowledge: Arcana, saying that the wizard is subtly altering his gestures to accomodate his casting in armor...
Then make the check something like (off the top of my head):
Light Armor: DC 10 + Spell Level
Med. Armor: DC 15 + Spell Level
Heavy Armor: DC 20 + Spell Level
Adjust as needed... and voila! We have a method where a caster can LEARN to cast spells in armor if he feels like it. *AND* it keeps those multi-classed casters from easily tossing out big spells in armor.
However, I think the way it is actually implemented in 3e is a sacred cow and needs to be removed.
We have a wonderful method for distractions in the Concentration skill. Or even use Spellcraft or Knowledge: Arcana, saying that the wizard is subtly altering his gestures to accomodate his casting in armor...
Then make the check something like (off the top of my head):
Light Armor: DC 10 + Spell Level
Med. Armor: DC 15 + Spell Level
Heavy Armor: DC 20 + Spell Level
Adjust as needed... and voila! We have a method where a caster can LEARN to cast spells in armor if he feels like it. *AND* it keeps those multi-classed casters from easily tossing out big spells in armor.
The Little Raven
First Post
These are the rules I use:
Arcane Spell Failure
An arcane spellcaster must make a Concentration check in order to cast spells while wearing armor.
The DC is 10 + spell's level + the armor's arcane spell failure divided by 5.
I've done a little tinkering and increased each of the DCs by 1 for each type of armor. I have an Armored Arcanist feat that allows a +4 bonus to Concentration checks to cast in armor.
Arcane Spell Failure
An arcane spellcaster must make a Concentration check in order to cast spells while wearing armor.
The DC is 10 + spell's level + the armor's arcane spell failure divided by 5.
I've done a little tinkering and increased each of the DCs by 1 for each type of armor. I have an Armored Arcanist feat that allows a +4 bonus to Concentration checks to cast in armor.
JChung2003
First Post
Rules as they are
If the spell has no somatic (S) component, you can cast it without having to make the Arcane Spell Failure check.
If you want to cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing armor without risking the arcane spell failure, get the Still Spell feat.
An alternative
Make new feats to allow arcane spellcasters to learn how to cast somatic spells while wearing armor. This would require a sorcerer or wizard to spend two feats to wear armor and cast without suffering arcane penalties (armor proficiency and armored arcane casting). Bards already have light and medium armor proficiencies.
Armored Arcane Casting (light)
Prerequisites: Armor Proficiency (light), 4 ranks of Concentration
Benefit: You do not have to make an arcane spell failure check when casting a spell with a somatic (S) component while wearing light armor.
[3.5] Note: Bards gain this feat at level 1 even if they do not satisfy the prerequisite requirements.
Armored Arcane Casting (medium)
Prerequisites: Armor Proficiency (medium), 8 ranks of Concentration
Benefit: You do not have to make an arcane spell failure check when casting a spell with a somatic (S) component while wearing medium armor.
Armored Arcane Casting (heavy)
Prerequisites: Armor Proficiency (heavy), 16 ranks of Concentration
Benefit: You do not have to make an arcane spell failure check when casting a spell with a somatic (S) component while wearing heavy armor.
I included the Concentration ranks requirement so that people don't cheese it and get a level of cleric or fighter to get the armor proficiency feats easily.
If the spell has no somatic (S) component, you can cast it without having to make the Arcane Spell Failure check.
If you want to cast a spell with a somatic component while wearing armor without risking the arcane spell failure, get the Still Spell feat.
An alternative
Make new feats to allow arcane spellcasters to learn how to cast somatic spells while wearing armor. This would require a sorcerer or wizard to spend two feats to wear armor and cast without suffering arcane penalties (armor proficiency and armored arcane casting). Bards already have light and medium armor proficiencies.
Armored Arcane Casting (light)
Prerequisites: Armor Proficiency (light), 4 ranks of Concentration
Benefit: You do not have to make an arcane spell failure check when casting a spell with a somatic (S) component while wearing light armor.
[3.5] Note: Bards gain this feat at level 1 even if they do not satisfy the prerequisite requirements.
Armored Arcane Casting (medium)
Prerequisites: Armor Proficiency (medium), 8 ranks of Concentration
Benefit: You do not have to make an arcane spell failure check when casting a spell with a somatic (S) component while wearing medium armor.
Armored Arcane Casting (heavy)
Prerequisites: Armor Proficiency (heavy), 16 ranks of Concentration
Benefit: You do not have to make an arcane spell failure check when casting a spell with a somatic (S) component while wearing heavy armor.
I included the Concentration ranks requirement so that people don't cheese it and get a level of cleric or fighter to get the armor proficiency feats easily.
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Shard O'Glase
First Post
ASF should just be SF. Anyone who isn't proficient in the armor suffers teh SF percentage. Clerics cleverly are already proficient in all armors so it sin't a big dea for the wizards would either have to burn feats or a lvel in a class that gave armor prof.
Currently we use still spell to get aorund it, but this is just a sucky system to use.
Currently we use still spell to get aorund it, but this is just a sucky system to use.
Kusuf ibn Zaid
Explorer
In my campaign I use an alternate formulation of arcane spell failure. Instead of a flat percentage based on the type of armor being worn, wearing armor and casting a spell requires a Concentration check (DC 10 + spell level). The armor's armor check penalty is applied to this skill check. This system has the advantage that is easier to cast a low level spell while wearing armor.
- Kusuf
- Kusuf
