Archery Full Round Attack

[Water Bob]

Or, to put it more simply, put up or shut up.

Oohhh. Getting a little snippy, aren't we?

I suggest, since you feel that way about me, that you ignore my posts from now on. It will keep you from getting upset. '

Just act like I'm not there. Follow my advice. You'll live longer.

And, try not to be like Dandu. He agrees with you, but he can't help but sticking his nose into my threads and making snarky comments or idiotic Buddah statements. He can't stand my topics or my posts, but like a rubber-necker on the freeway, he can't help but slowing down and watching the accident. Why does he feel the need to continually interact with me if he can't stand me or my posts?

If you guys don't like me, then, please, do yourself, myself, the forum--everyone--a favor and just ignore me.

You'll have a more pleasant day that way. I promise.

 

[Greenfield]

Water Bob, I never said I don't like you.

You made a point, and I asked you to support it. You didn't.

All I'm asking is that you either step up and support it, or step down and let it go.

Say what you mean, clearly, instead of the "yes but no" stuff you seem so fond of.

 

[the Jester]

I saw it, every time, and I ignored it because I thought you would figure out that it is moot to the discussion.

Why?

When throwing two axes, you don't need a special feat to do it. A character can do it, albeit with a penalty.

My assertion is that the bowman should be able to do the same thing.

But that assertion is silly, as indicated by the people familiar with archery in this thread and historical records.

 

[Water Bob]

Water Bob, I never said I don't like you.

Let's just give it a rest. I don't think we're getting anywhere at this point. Other people understand my point as evidenced by their replies in the thread. Look at what Hermann The Wise wrote.

I don't mean this to sound snarky, but I just don't want to keep explaining myself to you.

We'll give this one a rest and meet back up on the forum at a later time. That's probably best.

But that assertion is silly, as indicated by the people familiar with archery in this thread and historical records.

See, I don't know if I agree that it's silly. And, I'm not sure if I'm correct, either. I know that I'm "wrong" concerning the game rules, but I want to understand the game rule. The effort to pull an axe from your belt (a free action with a BAB +1 or better), aim, and chunk it at the enemy seems to be about the same amount of effort an archer needs to pull and arrow, nock it, aim, and let fly.

I don't think the game rules mean that a fighter with axes in both hands actually throws them simultaneously becuase the fighter can throw them at different targets with no penalty.

Thus, I think that its reasonable that a 1st level archer, without any special feat, should be able to loose two arrows in a six second combat around (but have penalties, like the two weapon fighter does).

 

[Greenfield]

I don't mean this to sound snarky, but I just don't want to keep explaining myself to you.

Now that's funny. All I've been asking is that you explain yourself, and you never have. You've just repeated the same claim, over and over again.

But we agree on one thing. It's time for both of us to walk away.

 

[anest1s]

See, I don't know if I agree that it's silly. And, I'm not sure if I'm correct, either. I know that I'm "wrong" concerning the game rules, but I want to understand the game rule. The effort to pull an axe from your belt (a free action with a BAB +1 or better), aim, and chunk it at the enemy seems to be about the same amount of effort an archer needs to pull and arrow, nock it, aim, and let fly.

You can draw only one axe from your belt, as a free action.

 

[Tovec]

I saw it, every time, and I ignored it because I thought you would figure out that it is moot to the discussion.

Why?

When throwing two axes, you don't need a special feat to do it. A character can do it, albeit with a penalty.

My assertion is that the bowman should be able to do the same thing.

You want this for Bow users, so that we know you can try and hit with two arrows without feats?

Normal penalties:
-6 Primary Hand
-10 Off Hand

Off-hand weapon is light:
-4 Primary Hand
-8 Off Hand

Two-Weapon Fighting feat:
-4 Primary Hand
-4 Off Hand

Off-hand weapon is light and Two-Weapon Fighting feat:
-2 Primary Hand
-2 Off Hand


(taken from 'Two-Weapon Fighting' at Special Attacks :: d20srd.org)

 

[Water Bob]

You want this for Bow users, so that we know you can try and hit with two arrows without feats?

I'm not sure if I want it, but something like it seems logical.

And, probably more like the way the Conan game does it.

Normal penalties:
-6 Primary Hand
-10 Off Hand

In Conan, it's -6 to both hands.

Off-hand weapon is light:
-4 Primary Hand
-8 Off Hand

Conan: -2 to both hands. And, only one weapon needs to be light, not necessarily the one in the off hand.

Two-Weapon Fighting feat:
-4 Primary Hand
-4 Off Hand

Same in Conan.

Off-hand weapon is light and Two-Weapon Fighting feat:
-2 Primary Hand
-2 Off Hand

Conan: no penalty at all.


I would see the bowman closer those penalties rather than the D&D version, and of course, the Feat would change.

I don't plan on changing RAW in my game, but something like: -6 to both shots without a Feat; -2 to both shots with a Feat; No penalty when you get into Rapid Shot and the like.

 

[Greenfield]

You can draw only one axe from your belt, as a free action.

Drawing a weapon is a Move Equivalent action, meaning that you can do it as a move action, or as part of a move if your BAB is +1 or greater.

The difference is that you can do it as you move before or after an attack, but not as part of a full attack sequence. That calls for the Quick Draw feat.

Not at all compatible with TWF, or any sort of iterative attack sequence.

 

[Water Bob]

Drawing a weapon is a Move Equivalent action, meaning that you can do it as a move action, or as part of a move if your BAB is +1 or greater.

The difference is that you can do it as you move before or after an attack, but not as part of a full attack sequence. That calls for the Quick Draw feat.

Not at all compatible with TWF, or any sort of iterative attack sequence.

I'm glad you brought this up. I don't think I have a good grasp of this rule.

My Conan book sometimes says things a little differently than what you see in normal D&D, but I'm not so sure this is one of those cases.

It says: If a character has a base attack bonus of +1 or higher, he may draw a weapon as a free action combined with a regular move. If he has the Two-Weapon Fighting feat, he can draw two light or one-handed weapons in the time it would normally take to draw one.

So basically, what I'm reading there is that it costs a move action (provided BAB +1 or better) if you don't move, or it's free if you do move. As you say, you can't do a Full Round action and draw your weapon in the same round.