Are Druids regarded as the most powerful class in 3.5?

[jasin]

A bear? Or a dire bear?

A bear (brown) is plenty to make a wildshaped druid scary.

I have never thought of druids as scholars.

I've yet to see a druid without knowledge (nature) maxed, and they get a class ability that gives them +2 to knowledge (nature). They seem like nature scholars to me. Not eyeglasses-wearing, paper-shuffling scholars, but scholars none the less.

 

[jasin]

And, depending on the version of wildshaping you're using (i.e., whether you're using the WotC errata on the polymorph school), they can be butt-kickers in melee.

What's the gist of the errata? IIRC, errataed wildshape still gets you Str, Dex, Con and natural armour. You keep your own hp, but that just means you have just as many hp as a cleric, and only slightly less than a fighter.

 

[Darklone]

What's that about animal growth? When/how was it changed?

They clarified somewhere that druids in wildshape count as humans... so Animal Growth does not help them.

 

[Darklone]

What's the gist of the errata? IIRC, errataed wildshape still gets you Str, Dex, Con and natural armour. You keep your own hp, but that just means you have just as many hp as a cleric, and only slightly less than a fighter.

The problem is that you ONLY need Con and Wis as a druid.

 

[axp_dave]

I agree that the Druids make some of the toughest characters overall. Their spells are nearly on par with a wizard for damage, they can fight in melee well enough to handle themselves, and wildshape is a huge boost even when not abused.

The wildshape arguement about seeing different animals is a fair one. Regular animals a Druid may know, but not dinosaurs or dire creatures.

In my game we've had a few druids and the ones that acted as a spell slinger from the rear did a lot of damage on par with the mage and the melee and wildshape abilities were just an added bonus.

Because of all of the options to do in combat the Druid is a lot of fun to play.
DAvid

 

[Aust Diamondew]

Druids are definitley one of the most powerful classes but I'm not sure they are the most powerful or even over powered so much as that shape shifting is generally overpowered in D&D (such as when you high level sorcerer turns into a balor or a lower lever one into a troll).

Cleric and druid are proably the two most powerful of the core classes, ironically they are proably the least played in the groups I've been in (people come up with character concepts for the other classes easier).

 

[Henry]

Having played a very-high to epic-level druid, wildshape ain't what it's cracked up to be. Very few animals have an armor class naturally above a 20, and if your DM doesn't allow that "wild" enhancement to armor or miscellaneous items, turning into wildshape means depending on NOTHING but the animal's and your natural stats. It's great that you have a 30 STR... until a high-level fighter or melee-monster gets within 5 to 15 feet of you...

Now, one thing I used to do was wildshape into a legendary form, and then use Nature's Avatar (9th level Spell Compendium spell) now THAT made me a combat monster -- however, WotC may have ruled at some point that Druids don't get the "Animal" subtype like it says they do in the rules, so that would be stifled.

Druids do, however, excel at powerful area-control spells, and they do excel at overcoming a creature's spell resistance, thanks to conjurations being their strongest suit. My favorite trick was to assume a fast flying form (eagle, legendary eagle, or similar), summon help, and let the help tear around the countryside. When I needed to cast some world-shaking spells, I'd light on a safe area, far from combat, and toss out some stuff from the Spell Compendium -- Bombardment, greater whirlwind, cometfall, Rapid-ized firestorms, arc of lightning, etc. If I was in bad trouble quickly, I'd toss out a Rapid-ized Nature's Ally VII or VIII, and run away as fast as my little longstrider-legs would carry me.

Clerics still have my money as "most powerful." A fully buffed cleric of Strength with his divine power, righteous might, etc. going would still wreck a battelfield...

 

[szilard]

I played a Druid to 20th level. I was far from min-maxed. My physical ability scores weren't minimized despite point-buy. I never even used an animal companion - or summon natures ally (I used the spontaneous rejuvenation option... but only rarely). Three of the other players in the campaign had custom prestige classes that optimized their concepts (Warmage-Paladin, Bard-Barbarian, and Scout-Wizard). The fourth player was playing a Dervish (with Fighter, Rogue, and Scout levels).

I was easily the most powerful character in the game, to the point where it became a running joke.

Why?

Three reasons:

1) The Druid is all-around competent. Decent BAB, HD, skills, and saves. It doesn't have any real weaknesses, other than maybe AC. They have few must-have feats (Natural Spell... and maybe Scribe Scroll).

2) Wild Shape. I usually used a Dire Wolverine form - it was the first large animal predator we met in the campaign. If you want to min-max, use your physical stats as a dumping ground and depend on Wild Shape - it replaces them, as opposed to adding to them.

3) Spells. PHB Druid spells aren't bad at all. The Spell Compendium, though, has some terrifying Druid spells. There are nice long term buffs like Essence of the Raptor - that capitalize on some of your strengths. The "Bite of the Werewhatever" spells are hideously powerful when combined with Wild Shape. At high levels, Bombardment is an amazing attack spell. As noted above, there are a number of army-destroying spells - some of which you get fairly quickly. Druids have a lot of powerful specialized spells that will see occasional, but uncommon use - that is what Scribe Scroll is for....

-Stuart

 

[szilard]

Having played a very-high to epic-level druid, wildshape ain't what it's cracked up to be. Very few animals have an armor class naturally above a 20, and if your DM doesn't allow that "wild" enhancement to armor or miscellaneous items, turning into wildshape means depending on NOTHING but the animal's and your natural stats. It's great that you have a 30 STR... until a high-level fighter or melee-monster gets within 5 to 15 feet of you...

Wild Shape is useful until you get Shapechange.

After that, you don't really need it anyway.

-Stuart

 

[el-remmen]

They seem like nature scholars to me. Not eyeglasses-wearing, paper-shuffling scholars, but scholars none the less.

Point taken.

But still, it could just as easily be justified by some "mystical" means, by which until you are in the presence of an animal spirit, you can never truly know/be the animals spirit. . . Or whatever. . .

And I guess I should probably withdraw my assertion that my ruling "easily counters abuse", upon thinking about it I realized I don't really know if it would - since 1) no one has played a druid with wild-shaping ability in one of my games since 2E days, and 2) I don't have the type of players who would comb the books looking for the most optimized animal form.