D&D 4E Are powers samey?

[Zardnaar]

How did niche protection break down in 2e? that is an edition i am almost completely disconnected from. Yes i read the DMG and players handbook even still own them but?

Priests started packing wizard spells.

 

[Garthanos]

That said - from an intra-class perspective - 5e's prepackaged subclass abilities tend to be far more unique than you would typically achieve using 4e's class building blocks.

The example fighter subclasses do not vary that much the are on a big tanky not so mobile striker main frame that cannot even be shifted for a few levels. I can play a non-attacking Warlord who is very effective via power selection almost entirely. The building blocks in powers are very flexible.

 

[Garthanos]

Priests started packing wizard spells.

Was that the god specific priest option? I admit the one mans witch is another's sainted holy person paradigm always affected my point of view a bit anyway.

 

[Zardnaar]

Was that the god specific priest option? I admit the one mans witch is another's sainted holy person paradigm always affected my point of view a bit anyway.

Yes some if the FR and GH deities granted wizard spells.

Or granted wizard spells as powers.

 

[FrogReaver]

The example fighter subclasses do not vary that much the are on a big tanky not so mobile striker main frame that cannot even be shifted for a few levels. I can play a non-attacking Warlord who is very effective via power selection almost entirely. The building blocks in powers are very flexible.

I think you missed the word typical in my post. I don't believe the 4e lazylord was a typical use case for what powers did. That was an exception build ( was it even playable in PHB 1?)

But more to the point - you are jumping around from fighters to warlords and back again. We are talking intra-class so please try to stick with the class we were discussing.

What 4e fighter powers do anything as unique from each other as the 5e fighter subclasses - because that's the point I'm making and I don't see you providing any counter examples to it.

 

[Garthanos]

I think you missed the word typical in my post. I don't believe the 4e lazylord was a typical use case for what powers did. That was an exception build ( was it even playable in PHB 1?)

Do tell me about that requirement when a defender is crap in the 5e phb.

But more to the point - you are jumping around from fighters to warlords and back again. We are talking intra-class so please try to stick with the class we were discussing.

Hey the Battlemaster i am told is supposed to be the 5e Warlord and to my thinking the 5e fighter is really the 4e Ranger and no the Battlemaster and Champion are again so different because who hoo once a fight I get to knock somebody down and woohoo once a fight i get an extra critical

Players handbook doesnt look to me vary variable at all in 5e land I get a ranger and a ranger with minor fluff differences all tanky non mobile striker frame.

 

[Garthanos]

Incredibly monotone out of the box.

 

[FrogReaver]

Do tell me about that requirement when a defender is crap in the 5e phb.

Hey the Battlemaster i am told is supposed to be the 5e Warlord and to my thinking the 5e fighter is really the 4e Ranger and no the Battlemaster and Champion are again so different because who hoo once a fight I get to knock somebody down and woohoo once a fight i get an extra critical

Players handbook doesnt look to me vary variable at all in 5e land I get a ranger and a ranger with minor fluff differences all tanky non mobile striker frame.

You sound bitter

 

[Garthanos]

You sound bitter

The cake is a lie.

 

[FrogReaver]

A 5e Battlemaster fighter at level 3 has:

At Will: Duelist Fighting Style Attack
Str or Dex vs AC
Requirement: 1 Handed Weapon and no weapon in the other hand
1W+mod+2 damage

At Will: Help
Effect: Ally gains advantage

At Will: Push Attack
Str or Dex vs AC
Effect: You push the enemy 1 space

At Will: Prone Attack
Str vs Fort
Effect: You prone the enemy

At Will: Grapple
Str vs Fort or Reflex
Effect: You grapple the enemy

Utility Encounter: 2nd Wind
Effect: Heal 1d10+fighter level hp

Utility Encounter: Action Surge
Effect: Gain an extra action

Encounter: BattleMaster Manuever 1 - *Reliable
Str or dex vs AC
2W+mod+2 + prone (save to avoid)

Encounter: BattleMaster Manuever 2 - *Reliable
Str or dex vs AC
2W+mod+2 + prone (save to avoid)

Encounter: BattleMaster Manuever 3 - *Reliable
Str or dex vs AC
2W+mod+2 + prone (save to avoid)

Encounter: BattleMaster Manuever 4 - *Reliable
Str or dex vs AC
2W+mod+2 + prone (save to avoid)

That's 5 at will's and 4 encounter powers and 2 utility powers by 3rd level.

In 4e you would have 2 at wills, 2 encounters, 1 daily and 1 utility by level 3. (and 1 additional at will power for marking I suppose)

I think 5e's natural language hides a lot of 4e style options that become readily apparent when put side by side in 4e's presentation.