D&D 5E Are ranged attacks too good in 5e?

Bill Zebub

“It’s probably Matt Mercer’s fault.”
There may be a good realism argument about strength and bows, but it breaks a 5e design parameter.

I mean, there's also a good argument to be made that dexterity and intelligence should factor into attack rolls with 2H swords, right?

But 5e just doesn't go there.
 

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OB1

Jedi Master
This is correct, but unfortunately, most enemies want to engage in melee themselves, and from what I've seen, even in published adventures, cover is not presented often enough in encounter design.

And as for the axe/bow fight comments, I'm talking about building a character who doesn't even bother with melee and just uses a bow the vast majority of the time.
I've found the opposite in published adventures, and the majority of the encounters I design have cover available, makes for more interesting combat, but YMMV. And enemies engaging in melee are the best solution to ranged attacks, since it causes the ranged attacker to be at disadvantage or switch to a less effective melee attack themselves (assuming they've done everything they can to be an excellent ranged attacker), and also brings up the possibility of an opportunity attack if they try and get away.
This is highly terrain dependent.

Also, there are no more penalties to shooting in melee (I do impose a cover penalty if your ally is between you and your target, but still). Also, cover penalties can be circumvented by sharpshooter and mitigated by archery fighting style.

Furthermore, high dex give ranged combatant an initiative advantage, stealth for positioning/ambushing... not to mention great ease of focus fire.
It is terrain dependent, but full cover is not a high barrier to provide in almost any encounter. As for shooting into melee, I often grant advantage when shooting into a group of enemies, but disadvantage if shooting into a melee group with enemies and allies. Per the rules in the PHB The DM can also decide that circumstances influence a roll in one direction or the other and grant advantage or impose disadvantage as a result.

And full cover can't be circumvented or mitigated by any feat or fighting style.
 

kevbeck45

Explorer
Honestly I never saw anything that made me think that until I saw Sharpshooter. Without the sharpshooter feat I think ranged combat is just fine. A lot of it is the dungeon master making adjustments if they think it is overpowered.
 


My vote would be "yes, but not in a gamebreaking way". Having ranged be the beneficiary of the strongest fighting style (ie: the one with a to hit bonus) is fair enough if you are actually using cover. But between tables that don't really bother with half or three quarters cover (the sin is with the designers for making the +2 and +5 AC bonuses a completely arbitrary thing that requires rote memorization) and having a feat that eliminates partial cover, and having so little use of basic damage resistances that being married to piercing damage isn't a big deal, it does feel a little too strong for the guy who also gets to stay back from the front line, gets the most choice in targets, almost never has to waste a turn getting into position or being stuck somewhere away from targets, and gets to laugh at any enemy who thinks flight will keep them safe.

But, in actual gameplay I don't really see it that way.

First off there are more abilities that work with melee damage, including some extremely powerful ones like Paladin smites and Barbarian Reckless Attacks. Sure some theoretical Ranged Battlemaster may do better than some theoretical Melee Battlemaster, but if the latter is optimizing with multiclass dips things start looking real different real fast. Secondly it is a lot easier to make a melee character not married to a particular weapon, which increases the likelihood of a melee character having the best possible magic weapon available in actual gameplay. Mileage will vary, of course, based on the DM and the campaign, but if your game ever involves magic weapons that aren't 100% intended for a particular PC the melee character is more often than not going to be better equipped than the ranged character, at least if they let the character develop with the campaign. Meanwhile if you're married to a handcrossbow, sure you'll get that +1 handcrossbow you want fairly early on probably, but you probably can't reasonably expect a lot more incremental upgrade handcrossbows to come your way at most tables.

But most importantly, ranged may, once feated up, do more damage than melee, but melee also forms the frontline that makes all that ranged damage possible. I don't like the term "tank" because it evokes a lot of cheesy tactics for gaming MMO AI that don't really apply with most DMs, but you generally need at least one person regularly in melee with the enemy, and another person at least sometimes in melee with the enemy to lock down enemies and keep them from going wherever they want on the battlefield and gobbling up your spellcasters. Doing the most damage is not the only measure of usefulness. I've played ranged fighters and rangers, and sometimes those characters have been the ones consistently doing the most damage, but they've never been a character whom anyone would vote MVP of their party or who otherwise felt particularly powerful or important.

Right now I'm playing an Arcane Archer in a campaign where we started at level 8 with our pick of magical items on a healthy budget. Between a +3 bow, bracers of Archery, a 20 dexterity, and the Sharpshooter feat, he can do a flat +20 to damage, and with curving shot can usually turn his misses into hits. So damage-wise he packs a wallop. But the character is basically useless for anything other than doing damage (and the occasional dex-based abilty check). And if I'd known how often our poor Rogue was going to not get set up for sneak attack I'd have played something melee.
 

James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
I may have a skewed perspective because of how effective my ranged character was. I'll just put his sheet here. And yes, I know, dumping Wis was silly, but it fit the personality I had for the character. But it turned out that his suite of abilities ensured he was nearly impossible to pin down (even before I got the Broom of Flying), and the one time the DM was like "ok, the monsters are tired of your ranged shenanigans", he found himself stymied by my high hit point pool (and second wind).
 

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Micah Sweet

Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
There may be a good realism argument about strength and bows, but it breaks a 5e design parameter.

I mean, there's also a good argument to be made that dexterity and intelligence should factor into attack rolls with 2H swords, right?

But 5e just doesn't go there.
Good thing we don't always have to do what WotC says huh?
 

Bill Zebub

“It’s probably Matt Mercer’s fault.”
Good thing we don't always have to do what WotC says huh?

Of, sure, if we're just talking about house rules. I was speaking (writing) from a mindset of, "How should D&D work?"

EDIT: And, even then, I tend to avoid house rules that are against the design spirit of the game I'm playing.
 


James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
It's perfectly ok to consider how you'd fix the problem, if you think there is one. I mean, if we play the game as written, we're stuck with the way things are, though there are things you can do, like enforce cover, set up terrain that's difficult for a ranged character, inclement weather, that sort of thing.

I was about to mention enemy casters, who have a suite of spells that can stymie an archer....but a lot of those spells are problematic for melee as well. Hope you got someone with dispel magic or counterspell around.
 

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