Armor as DR

[JVisgaitis]

Oh, a couple of other things...

So how do you handle piecemeal armor and damage to armor?

 

[Nyaricus]

A note for spellcasters and touch ACs: instead of BAB, let them use their Caster Level. So, a 8th level Sorcerer would have +8 to hit with touch spells, instead of +4 (for his BAB). This would really help. It would be much like a fighters training allows him to hit better with a sword, except the magical training allows this spellcaster to hit with his spells better, due to his knowledge of them.

As for the system itself, it's an idea I've kicked around a bit. Some notes:

Natural Armour should become DR x/- (or maybe DR x/magical for some all). This evens the playing ground, making some foes really easy to hit but hard as hell to acually damage (like polar bears, which IIRC, have a NAB of +7).

All enemies should, of course, utilize the same rules as the PCs. All armour gets changed into DR, etc. This goes for allies too

A Base Armour Bonus which each class accures (a common/popular one is Base Armour Bonus [or BArB] = base Attack Bonus/2) is a really good idea, since your AC is gonna suck, bad.

Magic enhancements for armour should be +DR, not +'s to AC

Shields should still provide a true armour bonus, since their purpose is to keep blows from hitting your body in the first place (whereas armour is there to absorb the blows you take) Magical enhancements for your shield should go to AC, not DR. This is a nice one, since it makes sword 'n' boarders actually useful

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That's about all I can think of right now; as you can tell, I've thought alot about this

 

[mirivor]

I did not read all of the replies, so apologies if this has been said.

I am an avid houserule fan. If I showed you my campaign handout, you would recognize D20 core rules only in a vague sense.

Using armor as DR is a great system, but there are a ton of repercussions that you should consider. Each seems small, but they set off ripples that can be hazardous to your game.

- What do you do about ranged touch attacks, which are one of the casters' few options at higher level? In my game, I use wound and vitality altered to suite my taste. Spells that deal dice of damage are very dangerous, as are spells in general, but it takes vitality to cast them, making casters (arcane, in particular) the glass jaws that they should be. Even clerics and other heartier casters must be very cautious about slinging their spells around.

- What does natural armor do? In my game, it works just like armor: divide the original AC by 2. Your resulting number is the DR. The remainder is your new AC. This seems whacked, as ancient wyrms now sport DR 19/-, but I have a lot of other changes in place that have made what I believe to be a really good, if grittier, system. In general terms, there are ways for all characters to increase their damage dealt by sacrificing other bonuses.

Those are the two big ones. Depending on how in-depth you get with your setting, these rules can make or break it. This changes spell casting, fighting, and just about every other aspect of your game. If you dig deep, it will change how war is fought, how adventurers function in society, how deadly a horde is to a high-level party, etc.

I love my system and wish you the best of luck.

Later!

-

 

[eschwenke]

Om the subject of Defense Ratings, does anyone use the Combat Defense rules from Advanced Player's Guide as featured in Monte Cook Presents The Years Best D20 Vol.1? I really like the idea of breaking it down into different ways to defend oneself, and out of all of the four ratings (Armor Defense, Block Defense, Dodge Defense, and Parry Defense) only Armor Defense doesn't scale as you level.
I'm currently tweaking those rules just a bit, and trying to integrate it with the facing rules from UA, and I might throw UA's Armor as DR in as well.

 

[reanjr]

Critical threats ignore DR.

 

[ValhallaGH]

Critical threats ignore DR.

That's crazy-powerful. Especially for groups that still allow Improved Crit and Keen to stack.

"Up, look, I rolled a 12+ and hit. So the Balor doesn't get his DR. Time for the crit check. Aww, only normal damage of 1d6+4."

 

[TheLe]

Perhaps you should treat DR as d6 rolls, which would still be very quick.

If you have DR 8, you get to roll 8d6. Each result of "1" successfully reduces the damage by 1. So, DR becomes less powerful, but also becomes a treat to players who get a good roll.

`Le

 

[Sadrik]

Here is another option:

All weapons do max damage but you roll your DR. That way, no new rolls are added to the game. It just transfers the roll from the attacker to the defender.

Example:
Longsword does 8 damage + str + magic + other bonuses
Full plate is 1d8 DR + magic + other bonuses

Armor + Natural Chart
1		1
2-3		1d2
4-5		1d4
6-7		1d6
8-9		1d8
10-11		1d6+1d4
12-13		2d6
14-15		1d6+1d8
16-17		2d8
18-19		3d6
20-21		2d6+1d8
22-23		2d8+1d6
24-25		4d6
etc

 

[glass]

I use armour as DR, as well as a form of Base Defence Bonus that scales with BAB. Also, weapons have AP values. In addition, there are called shots, including a general ´ármour defeating´ type. Another thing that springs to mind from my house rules is the uniform reduction of innate AC (Defence) bonuses in critters. Amazingly, it all works smoothly, and seems to be remarkably ´balanced´, to the extent that I can use almost any 3e supplemental material - when I wish to - with only a small amount of very quick and easy alteration required.
In creating the subsystem, I´ve used sources from ´Conan OGL´ to ´A Game of Thrones OGL´ to ´From Stone to Steel´ to ´Iron Heroes´, and others. Mainly though, I devoted a fair amount of my own time and thought to the combat system I wanted to have. I´m glad that I did so.

That sounds very cool. I keep meaning to do the same, but RL and general lethargy keep getting in the way.

Have you considered publishing your version as a PDF?


glass.

 

[GreatLemur]

Here is another option:

All weapons do max damage but you roll your DR. That way, no new rolls are added to the game. It just transfers the roll from the attacker to the defender.

Aw, that is different. I'm not sure if I like the idea or not, but it's damned well original. Hm.

So bigger weapons will still do bigger damage, but the question of exactly how much damage will depend on the armor type being attacked (and its DR roll), rather than on a damage roll... And unarmored opponents will be in dire trouble, of course... And you could use bigger dice to represent harder armor, and more dice to represent better coverage (since multiple dice produce a bell curve of results, making their rolls more reliable). So a breastplate could have d20 DR (since it's got great stopping power . . . as long as the enemy actually hits it), while a suit of chainmail could be something like 3d4 DR (since it's a lot harder to bypass completely, but doesn't stop a blow as well as a breastplate in a best-case scenario).

Hell, this could work.