Armor, Weapons, Gear - What level of detail?

[Mark CMG]

What level of detail would you like to see regarding armor, weapons, and other gear? How about the granularity and how should that level of detail figure into combat and skills? Should there be multiple levels? What particulars would you suggest?

 

[delericho]

The Core Rulebook should include broad categories of equipment (longsword, shortsword, greatsword) and not much else. Very little need for customisation here.

Then they should produce an "Arms & Equipment" guide which provides many more equipment types, along with a huge array of means to customise them. (In theory, they could put that 'module' in one of the splatbooks, like SWSE does with "Scum & Villainy". That's fine, of course - but that level of detail shouldn't be in the core.)

 

[El Mahdi]

I'd like to see each weapon have specific attack and defense bonuses based on the characteristics of the weapon (size, weight, reach, type, etc.). And with more realistic damage models.

For instance, an unarmed combatant would have no bonuses or penalties to fighting unarmed (except their BAB and ability bonuses); a dagger might have a +1 to attack and defense; a short sword might have a +2 to attack and defense; a long sword might have a +3 to attack and defense; a quarter staff might have a +2 to attack and a +4 to defense, etc.

And as far as damages, a dagger might have 1d3 or 1d4, but I think all swords (whether short/long/two-handed, etc.) should all have the same damage (such as 1d6 or 1d8). In reality, the damage each can do to a human body is practically equal, but their effectiveness at it are different - especially when used relative to eachother (short sword vs. long sword, etc.). Their relative effectiveness is better modeled with the individual attack and defense bonuses.

 

[Duke Arioch]

1. Lose the silly attacks/round from BAB, and make it depend on weight/size of the weapon;
2. Make finesseable weapons actually grant you finesse;
3. Weapon durability (based on hardiness) and maintenance (goes for armor too).

 

[Hassassin]

The core doesn't need a hundred types of sword, but I think there should be some detail in equipment in general. 1-3 pages on weapons, 1-3 pages on armor and shields, 1-3 on other adventuring gear, 1-2 on trade goods, hirelings, that sort of thing.

 

[steeldragons]

What level of detail would you like to see regarding armor, weapons, and other gear? How about the granularity and how should that level of detail figure into combat and skills? Should there be multiple levels? What particulars would you suggest?

Weapons
20 weapons in the Basic Weapon list....with their damage die.

Dagger...........Sling.................Club/Cudgel............Hand/Thrown Axe
St. Sword.......Hand X-bow.....Hammer.................Sickle
Broad Sword...St. Bow...........Staff.......................Spear
Lg. Sword.......Lg. Bow............Mace......................Halberd
2-hd Sword....X-bow...............War Hammer.........Battle Axe

I can't see needing any more than that to get rolling.

Add 20 more on some other optional "Weapon Expansion Module" in the back of the book or something...with, perhaps, some additional (10? more) on an "Exotic Weapons List."

Optional Weapon Rules: Weapons by Damage type (Slash/Pierce/Blunt); Weapons by Size; Weapons by Group ("Simple"/"Light"/"Melee"/"Heavy or "Two-handed"/wutev's wutev's). What/how those work in combat, v. certain armors, Speed and Reach rules, etc. All optional.

Armor
Padded/Furs, Leather, Studded Leather, Scale Mail, Chain Mail, Plate.

Shield.

Optional Armor Expansion: Ring Mail, Banded Mail, Partial/Field Plate
Optional Shield Expansion Module: Buckler, Small, Medium, Large, Tower (with various rules for how many attack[er]s they block or how much it goes toward Defenses or whatever).

Gear
Basic list of 20 items (yer backpack, yer torches, tinderbox, iron spikes, rope, etc. Adventurer's basic "must haves"). Individual Weight and "Average" Price.

10 "Specialty" items: holy symbols, mistletoe, spell components, thieves' tools, etc.

Optional Equipment Expansion list: 20-50 more detailed things for those who want that detail in their campaigns...with their weight and prices.

Optional Gear Rules: Encumbrance.

 

[Yora]

I'd like 6 to 8 weapon groups with 3 size categories for each, and call it a day.

6 degrees of armor are also enough.

 

[BobTheNob]

3. Weapon durability (based on hardiness) and maintenance (goes for armor too).

As an idea, I dont disagree with this. For my game however I would eschew such an idea.

One of the great goals I have with my game is that it runs at a good pace. One of the things I did for 4e however was getting rid of XP and "abstracting" wealth as I found these two sub-systems to be synonymous with accouting or bookkeeping. Giving up effort and game time to add numbers is just a waste of game time to me, and monitoring durability of individual items would be about as much fun as quantity surveying.

Candidate for optional?

 

[Sunseeker]

Small, medium, large.
bludgeoning, slashing, peircing.
light, medium, heavy.

3 categories for any type or item present a broad-enough matrix to create a wide variety of weapons, armor, equipment and accessories.

 

[Herremann the Wise]

Small, medium, large.
bludgeoning, slashing, peircing.
light, medium, heavy.

3 categories for any type or item present a broad-enough matrix to create a wide variety of weapons, armor, equipment and accessories.

On one level, I appreciate your thinking here. On another, there is a type of design issue that I think is arse-about when it comes to creativity.

Essentially, I don't like the idea that you have a scope of variables and that you engineer each permutation to fit each design "hole". I would much prefer that you have a particular concept, and then you use the game mechanics to model and reproduce that concept. I find in this way, the item you end up with is grounded in the fiction of the fantasy world and can carry lots of "good" fantasy baggage.

A particular permutation in mathematical design space does not carry this established "baggage" and when you try to hide this behind a thin sentence of flavour text (as was done for 4e powers), the perceived result can be very hit and miss.

My preference (in an advanced module) would be that each weapon or "piece/suit of armor is it's own thing, mechanically almost like a psuedo-class. Imagine your character is proficient in the longsword. This gives them access to several exploits in the longsword "class". As they achieve expertise/specialization/mastery, they get further abilities/exploits related to that particular weapon. This allows that weapon to be particularly individualised and modelled off of the rich fantasy baggage I was talking about before.

I prefer the mechanics to be slave to the description, rather than the description slave to the mechanics.

Best Regards
Herremann the Wise