Artificer's Handbook - anyone got it?

[der_kluge]

Now, normally I wouldn't be try to pimping out my own stuff like this, but Nightfall shamelessly plugged his Player's Guide to Wizards, Bards, and Sorcerers, so I'm not above doing the same.

Now, the product in question, Artificer's Handbook, by Mystic Eye Games, recently came onto the market, and debuted at GenCon. I know it's been selling quite well, which is great.

But, aside from one review at Mortality.net here (a 9.6 out of 10, I might add), there's been no talk of it, no mention of it, and most surprising, no questions about it.

The book has a completely revised magic item creation system, among other things. It's quite complex, and I'm just CERTAIN that people are going to have questions about it.

I, and several others, spent well over a year and half working on this book. It has tons of crunch, and tons of new rules. I told numerous people at GenCon that if they had any questions to not hesitate to ask.

But, I'm just dying here. I know its selling, and I know people have read it. But I'm not getting any kind of feedback. I'm in a void, and I'm quite anxious to know what people think of it, or if anyone has any questions about it.

As a side note, I'm thinking about the next book I want to write, and I think it's going to be a book of nothing but magic items and artifacts, each created with the rules from Artificer's Handbook, and each with detailed history, and description. Sound good?

 

[Crothian]

Well, you know I have a copy and I read it at Gen Con. I can say its a good book, but I've yet to really have a chance to see it in action.

 

[der_kluge]

So give me an item, Crothian, and I'll walk you through the process. Go on, make it something weird, even.

 

[Crothian]

We'll go with something simple, useful, and practical that I found myself wanting in my Sunday's game I play in. A rod that allows spells to be cast as if quickened. And because I don't know what the prices will be like, let's see what it would be for 1/day verse 5/day.

And somehow I feel like I'm in a commercial....

 

[Psion]

Now, the product in question, Artificer's Handbook, by Mystic Eye Games, recently came onto the market, and debuted at GenCon. I know it's been selling quite well, which is great.

But, aside from one review at Mortality.net here (a 9.6 out of 10, I might add), there's been no talk of it, no mention of it, and most surprising, no questions about it.

Well, I have it (got it at GenCon, remember. ), and I've even read it, but alas it's a way down on my reviews queue.

I do like that you took into account some things that the core rules fail to consider (frex, the impact of the initial spell duration when making a continuous item... kudos there.)

That said, I am not the type of person who has really ever been bothered by items costing xp, so perhaps I'm not quite in the target audience of the book. I do appreciate, however, that you accomodate a variety of approaches to the issue and provide "campaign rule" sheets in the Hero vein (you had to have been a hero player at one time, right? )

 

[der_kluge]

Psion, actually no. Never played Hero. It was someone else's idea (Ken Shannon). So, maybe he played Hero.

Thanks for the comments, though.

 

[der_kluge]

Crothian, are you wanting an item that essentially gives you the quickened meta-magic feat a certain number of times per day? That's quite an odd little item.

Or are you wanting it to be able to cast certain spells as Quickened? I'd need to know which spells you want in it if that's the case.

 

[Crothian]

An item that X times per day allows a spell to be cast as if it were quickened. It would not increase the spell level of the spell cast, and it coulbe applied to any spell the caster is able to cast.

 

[der_kluge]

Whoa, that's pretty hardcore. But, I'm sure it can be done. Simple item... he says....

And no increase in spell level?? Nice. That won't be cheap. Let's see if I can do it.

First off, I'd like anyone playing along try to create this item using core DMG rules.


What you describe is a "use-per" item, capable of producing a certain effect a number of times per day. In this case 1 "use-per" day, or 5 "uses-per" day. Hence the name.

Items that grant feats are "bonus items" which are calculated the same as +1 swords, or items that increase ability scores. So, essentially what you're describing is a use-per item that grants a feat. I'm almost embarrassed to say it, but our rules cover no such item, especially since the spell that would normally allow such a thing "borrow ability" specifically does not allow one to borrow meta-magic feats.

But all is not lost, it can still be created, we just have to do it in a roundabout way. Limited wish is that way. Since Limited Wish can replicate any spell 6th level or lower (with some restrictions), it's a perfect candidate for our rod.

Since it's likely that you can't cast "limited wish", you need spell-trigger, which essentially means that while some day you *can* cast it, right now you can't. If you could, then spell completion would be a slightly cheaper alternative.

From table 2.5, The cost for a "use-per" spell-trigger item usable once per day is 7. (3 base +4) 5 per day is 11 (3+8)

The spell we're going to put into it Limited Wish. But wait, what's that? You want it Quickened? No sweat. We just apply the Quicken Spell metamagic feat to our spell, which increases the spell level to 11. No problem. Obviously, some DMs might have a problem with such a thing, but we'll just extrapolate out based on the current charts, and we'll see where it gets us. In a technical sense, such an item couldn't be created.

But, an 11th level spell could be cast by a 21st level wizard if we extrapolate out. Our system certainly doesn't prohibit such anomalies.

The formula for the creation cost is:
10gp(spell level + caster level - 1) * number of spell slots ^2

Our caster level is 21, our spell level is 11, and we have 7 (or 11) from above. Plugging in the numbers:
10gp(11 + 21 - 1) * 7^2 = 10gp(31)*49 = 15,190gp (creation cost). The market cost would be 30,380gp which seems appropriate.

5 uses per day:
10gp(11 + 21 - 1) * 11^2 = 310gp*121=37,510gp (creation cost); market cost = 75,020gp


Now, technically, you could make a "minor wish" spell, use that as the basis for this item, and then it would be more legitimate. The effects would be lowered, but could work just the same. For example, if minor wish were a 5th level spell, it could replicate 4th level spells, etc, with the same qualifiers that limited wish has. But, you could legitimately "quicken" it to 9th level. The costs would be as follows:

10gp(9 + 17 - 1) * 7^2 = 250gp*49 = 12,250gp (market cost = 24,500gp)
10gp(9 + 17 - 1) * 11^2 = 250gp*121 = 30,250gp (market cost = 60,500gp) (for 5 uses per day)

This "minor wish" version is probably about all I'd let my players get away with.

Incidentally, this last version would require either 7 or 11 9th level spell slots to be created.

A 20th level Sorcerer with a 28 charisma is what would be required to cast seven 9th level spells to create this item. Casting eleven 9th level spells is practically impossible without some insane charisma. I'm not even going to consider the wizard since a sorcerer would be able to cast more 9th level spells in a day by default.

 

[BSF]

I actually took a look at this at a game store while I was on vacation. I was looking for an alternative system, but I ended up putting the book back down.

Though, that decision had more to do with the fact that I was on vacation and my wife and son were not having a good time watching me read books in a game store. The other issue was that it would require a lot of reworking for my character for the game I am playing in. By extension, it would also require some reworking for the game I run.

I don't want to leave you with the impression that I am lazy, but I just didn't have the time to seriously evaluate the book at the time. It is complex enough that I decided to pass on it until sometime in the future. But, with you here, I do have a few questions!

In all honesty, how much work is going to be required for a DM to replace the core magic item system with this alternative? I am getting ready to start a new campaign and might consider scrapping the core system.

As for weird items: How about these?

Dreamstone - 1/month allow owner to cast the Dream spell.

How about a +3 longsword that provides Energy resistance 5 for cold, fire and lightning and can cast a True Reincarnate 1/year (By decapitating the body. And yes, if the head is already removed, this ability will not work on the subject.)

Yes, these are _real_ items in my campaign. I'm wondering how they would stat out with the Artificer's Handbook.