Assassins: Just Plain Evil or Misunderstood?

[Kastil]

One of my players recently (and skillfully) twisted something I've been saying for quite some time. My belief that not all assassins are pure evil and sometimes it is necessary to 'off' someone. Let's face it, there are NPCs out there just dying to step up to the point of your blade. You know, asking for it and the 'he just fell back on it' bit only works so many times.

Anywho, I knew I was in trouble when the player's sweet innocent (okay, she's not that innocent) bard starting having a lot of angst in her posts. When I asked 'what's up with that?' the player told me he was building her up for the assassin PrC and the only problem was finding someone to kill to get into the elite clubhouse.

That's when my foot jammed itself into my mouth. The only thing saving me from digging up a good (besides the standard 'no' answer) excuse why that's not a good idea is my homebrew has a PrC class that would work. Sure there's a Bounty Hunter PrC out there but it really doesn't fit the way this character is going.

So what is everyone's thought? We've all had PCs at one time sent to kill someone and they weren't assassins or evil in alignment. I know I have.

 

[hong]

The DMG assassin is evil because, well, that's what that class is. There's nothing stopping you creating another class that's also about hunting down and killing people that doesn't have the evil tag attached to it; heck, the BoED has one that requires you to be good.

Anyway, I'm not sure what your question is. Are you looking for a reason to deny the player a hired-gun PrC? Do you want to know if people generally allow non-evil hired-gun PrCs in their games? Or what?

 

[John Q. Mayhem]

Keep in mind that the DMG assassin isn't "killer for money," it is more like the hashashin; members of an evil cult-like organization. I'd keep the prereqa, except for Evil alignment, and then just make it look exactly like the last 10 levels of rogue. This approach has worked for me in the past with similar PrC problems.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Keep in mind that the DMG assassin isn't "killer for money," it is more like the hashashin; members of an evil cult-like organization. I'd keep the prereqa, except for Evil alignment, and then just make it look exactly like the last 10 levels of rogue. This approach has worked for me in the past with similar PrC problems.

I am not sure if the organization behind it is the real reason, I think it is the money and profit the assassin gains. (But I didn´t reread the assassin flavour text, so I might be wrong).
At least, here is my take on the assassin:

I think the most important aspect that makes the assassin evil is not that he kills people, but why.
He isn`t doing it for the greater good, for a friend, to rescue his wife. He only does it for money. He doesn´t care if he kills a demon, a pregnant wife and his unborn child, or his own grandmother.
He does it, because someone promises to pay him.
This is a most selfish behaviour, and since "good" also contains "altruistic", purely "selfish" behaviour probably needs evil.

The pure focus of the assassin class to kill people for profit and their own benefit is probably also the reason why an assassin is that good in his job. No morals, no mental obstacles...

Still, this does not make it impossible to have an alternate assasin class. but it probably would be more like a "dragonslayer" or "demonhunter" or something like that. Bound to kill evil creature, people who deserve it. But that is not the way of the assassin.

 

[Calico_Jack73]

I'd err on the side of misunderstood. If a Marine Sniper can kill a dictator who is waging war on innocent people and prevent massive bloodshed with the single pull of a trigger I'd be more inclined to call him a saint instead of a sinner.

Edit: The DMG Assassin. I agree that he is evil. They have to kill someone for no other reason than to join the Assassins guild. However, there is a "Good" Assassin in the BOED and they are pretty sweet.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I'd err on the side of misunderstood. If a Marine Sniper can kill a dictator who is waging war on innocent people and prevent massive bloodshed with the single pull of a trigger I'd be more inclined to call him a saint instead of a sinner.

Well, the real world does not seem to have cosmological fundamental good and evil like the D&D world.
But there are some moral and ethical standards most people (and countries)seem to adhere, and somehow, most modern civilized states (maybe even all?) never send a marine or other elite group to kill a dictator. And there were many dictators (and probably still are) that could have been the target of such an assassination attempt. Instead of doing this, if somebody decides a dictator has to die, he engages him in a war.
The question is - are we just plain stupid that we don`t do it, or is there a moral reason for it? (well, this could still make us plain stupid in the view of some... )

Mustrum Ridcully

 

[Rel]

If you're indescriminately killing people for pay (or not for pay for that matter) then I'd say that you were unquestionably Evil under the D&D alignment system. I don't know whether that makes you "Pure Evil" or not. It depends on your definition.

The literary character that popped to mind immediately upon reading the thread title was Vlad Taltos from Steven Brust's "Jhereg" books. Again, under the D&D alignment system, I'd have to say that he was Evil. But other than that he was a pretty decent guy.

I guess that my point is that just because your alignment is one thing or another doesn't mean that every aspect of your personality is dominated by that alignment. It is merely a convenient categorizaion for certain game effects.

 

[Turanil]

So what is everyone's thought? We've all had PCs at one time sent to kill someone and they weren't assassins or evil in alignment. I know I have.

You may get a look at the Book of Exalted Deeds (a supplement on ultimate goodness, and creatures, classes, feats, etc. by WotC on the outer planes of good) has a prestige class: the Slayer of Domiel (p.73).

So the Slayer of Domiel is an organization of... LG assassins! The class is almost identical to the Assassin prestige class, except that the Slayer of Domiel does get slightly different special abilities. Of course, they are hired only to slay utterly evil creatures whose activities endanger innocents, etc.

You may not necessarily buy that book, but want to design a similar order of good (or at least neutral) aligned slayers. The requirement would be to perform a mission of killing against a demon or what not. Then, you may change one or two special abilities, such as removing poison use and giving it, say Detect evil as per the paladin.

 

[Kemrain]

An assassin needen't accept every offer that'd brought before him. An assassin can have scruples. While it is fairly evil to kill for profit, profiting from killing isn't evil- otherwise nearly all adventurers would be pushed in that direction. I'm reminded of the Kids in the Hall sketch where an assassin is hired to kill himself.
You don't have to kill children and little old ladies to be an assassin. Miriam Webster defines assassinate as "to murder by sudden or secret attack usually for impersonal reasons" or "to injure or destroy unexpectedly and treacherously." Nothing keeps you from making a Non-Evil assassin who used the first definition and kills for other people's personal reasons when he finds them to be justified. I could see a Neutral assassin, though they'd have to work at it. Hell, you could do it for free, no profiting from another's death at all. I can see it now...

"I work for a Non-Profit organization.. I'll kill him for you.. But, we do accept donations.. No pressure or anything."

Kemrain the [Evil].

 

[Calico_Jack73]

I used the Marine Sniper example to illustrate "Restraint". IMHO I think it is ridiculous to go to war with a dictator where numerous people will be killed and create a huge refugee issue when a single bullet can solve the whole problem (yes, I am one of those folks that still thinks the Iraqi war was a bad idea but I won't get into politics now).

Anyway, the point of restraint is that a DMG Assassin would show no restraint provided that the money was right. It wouldn't matter if the person he was assassinating was the scum of the earth or a saint. The Slayer of XXXXX in the BOVD evaluates his target... doing the right thing is more important. Most of his abilities won't even effect someone who is rightous.