Balancing fast healing

Personaly I treat each point of Fast Healing as a +1 LA, so if someone wanted to create a race with Fast Heal 5. A first level mage/sorceror with an 18 con would still only have 8 hp, but would have to join a party and fight CR 6 monsters. One average to good hit from the monsters and the character is at negative HP, second hit and they are dead. Not a big deal.

Besides if you really want to hurt something with Fast Healing, don't do HP damage, so stat damage.
 

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I'm not on the "-CON to balance" train. Fast healing is a minor nicity in combat, but even a number of rounds of fast healing 1 is just a single extra attack. Where it's useful is that it saves healing. If a first level character saves one to two healing spells on themselves in a day, that's almost an extra cleric along.

In my campaign, the PCs are on a 1-day quest for a god (5x 12-13th level) and had fast healing during the day. They didn't care about taking any damage as long as it didn't kill them, because it would be gone before the next battle. Made much different combats.

To sum up, fast healing makes you (a) more likely to take hits instead of otheres (soak a AoO or such) to preserve healing, and also you don't need healing for what you do get hit with. All in all that's a powerful boost in the effective number of healing spells cast.

Cheers,
Jim
 

I suppose it depends on the campaign, but at mid levels (6 to 8 or so) the avalability of wands of cure light wounds (or wands of lesser vigor) make healing between combats a formality. At high levels the loss in hit points due to Con is starting to add up, but fast healing 1 is kinda insignificant considering the amount of damage being done by attacks.

At low levels, fast healing 1 is worth a lot. It makes up for the Con penalty in 1 or 2 rounds, and can affect a combat significantly. Being able to recover between combats is like having an extra cleric, like blue says.

So it has a big effect on lower levels, and a small effect on high levels; sounds like LA with UA-style buyback. It seems to me like fast healing with Con penalty would involve a base of LA +2 or so, so you could start to pay it off (using UA rules) at levels 6 and 9.

I suspect that it doesn't really matter how much fast healing you have, as long as you balance it with twice the penalty to Con. If you are tenth level and have fast healing 5, you will also have 50 hit points less than a character without the Con penalty. They can survive that surprise round with a giant- you might not.

I'm not sure about this. But I think that there is no way, short of a LA, to make up for automatically healing all hit point damage between encounters.
 

How about... you have Fast Healing 1, but you can only heal a total up to some fixed number of HP each day. Scale this by level.

E.g.: at 1st level, you can only heal up to 1/2 your Con score. At 4th level, you can heal only up to your Con score. At 8th level, you can heal up to 2x your Con score, 12th = 4x Con score, 16th = 8x Con score, and so on... after 20th level you should be able to heal really quite a lot of damage, but that's not unbalancing at that level.

Basically, scale the benefit so it matches the environment.

-- N

EDIT: Er, as Pyrex suggests earlier. :)
 
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What happens if you make it 2 feats?, Or 3 feats if need be.

Physical Stability - stabalize at -9
prereq: con 14

Fast healing 1
prereq: Physical Stability
 

Based on the feedback given, it seems that unlimited fast healing:1 cannot be balanced without a LA. The advantage of being able to heal fully between combats is too great at lower levels. At mid to high levels, where wands of CLW etc. are very common, this feature becomes less important.

I would eyeball unlimited fast healing 1 as about a LA +2, assuming some kind of buy back. Up till 6th level or so the character would be at an advantage- less so until 9th level. Thereafter fast healing 1 wouldn't make much of a difference. Higher fast healing wouldn't be much better unless it started to make a big difference in combat. Fast healing 5 might be a LA +3, perhaps. Dunno.

Capping the fast healing makes it seem more like normal, natural healing. With rest, everyone gets back 1 hp/level/per day. Using Sigurd's idea of feats, consider allowing a feat that gives 1 hp/level/day of additional healing. This is comparable to Improved Toughness, but maybe on the weak side since it doesn't improve your maximum capacity; the natural healing is also "wasted" if you have a cleric who could easily heal you back to maximum at the end of the day. If you could use it like a personal lay on hands effect it could help you between combats.

I kinda like the idea of someone having fewer maximum hit points (and thus less capable of dealing with one tough fight) but being able to withstand more damage over several encounters on the same day. Thus a Con penalty in exchange for fast healing (even if its capped). And really, a monster's fast healing is usually capped by the length of an encounter- it doesn't fight the characters all day- only for a few rounds. Why shouldn't character's fast healing also be capped? (There's an idea- it works for only 1 encounter/day... too bad that there are no hard rules for determining when an encounter has ended.)

How about this: the character takes a Con penalty of -2, and in exchange gets fast healing 1 for level x level rounds per day. Fast healing can be stopped or started as an immediate action. This exchange of Con for fast healing can be made multiple times; -4 to Con for fast healing 2, etc.. The fast healing doesn't function if the character does not have a Con score.

At first level the hit points are a bit of a wash- your max hit points are 1 less, but you can heal 1 hp of damage 1/day. That allows you to stabilize 1/day automatically. But your fort save is 1 less, and so is your Concentration score, the amount of time you can hold your breath, and so on. No big deal.

At higher levels the hit points might be a concern; attacks that would have left you in positive hit points might now knock you unconscious. But your natural healing will eventually make you a lot less dependent on the party cleric. Of course, some characters will receive multiple heal spells in one combat, not to mention the other ailments that clerics can mend. But still.

A 20th level fighter with 18 Con might have 200 hit points. If he takes fast healing 5 his Con will drop to 8, and he'll have only 100 hit points. He'll be able to heal 5 x 20 x 20 = 2000 hit points per day. Which won't help him if a giant cricals and does him 112 hp in one hit!

Anyway, that's the sort of thing I'm considering right now. People have been leaving some great feedback, and I want to thank you all for it.
 

Cheiromancer said:
I would eyeball unlimited fast healing 1 as about a LA +2, assuming some kind of buy back. Up till 6th level or so the character would be at an advantage- less so until 9th level. Thereafter fast healing 1 wouldn't make much of a difference. Higher fast healing wouldn't be much better unless it started to make a big difference in combat. Fast healing 5 might be a LA +3, perhaps. Dunno.

I don't know; while I think +2 makes a fine "minimum LA" for any creature with Fast Healing 1, I don't think that Fast Healing can carry the Level Adjustment on its own, unless the amount of Fast Healing automatically scales with level in some meaningful fashion.

It's like you point out-- it's a powerful advantage until 6th, and a moderate advantage until around 10th-12th. After that, all it really does for you is save you the effort of rolling stabilization checks.

I think that +2 LA would work for Fast Healing of 1/4th HD.

Speaking of attribute damage, though... isn't it odd that creatures with Fast Healing and Regeneration don't recover from attribute damage faster? It seems that they should recover from STR/DEX/CON damage at least marginally faster than creatures without.
 

Korimyr the Rat said:
I don't know; while I think +2 makes a fine "minimum LA" for any creature with Fast Healing 1, I don't think that Fast Healing can carry the Level Adjustment on its own, unless the amount of Fast Healing automatically scales with level in some meaningful fashion.

It's like you point out-- it's a powerful advantage until 6th, and a moderate advantage until around 10th-12th. After that, all it really does for you is save you the effort of rolling stabilization checks.

I'm assuming that the character could use the "LA buyoff" rules found in UA. For LA +2 it means that at sixth level you drop to the minimum xp needed for 5th level instead of advancing; your LA goes from +2 to +1. When you have the xp needed for 9th level you drop xp again, and your LA reduces to +0. So you'll be behind in xp, but the default rules allow lower level characters to gain xp faster, so you'll catch up.

So basically at higher levels your character will be a bit behind in xp- as if you had stayed home for a couple of sessions. Or that you invested xp in making a permanent curative magic item.
 


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