Barbarian cheese? Some advice

[Sidekick]

Hello there Enworlders. I’m about to start DMing a campaign & I was wondering about barbarians.

I’ve never DMed the Barb class before and wanted some tips and heads up about

1) builds to watch out for
AND
2) rules that I should bone up on and be aware of (so that my players don’t try to ‘forget’ rules

Many thanks, my players are generally very good at not abusing rules or creating characters to ‘win’. I just wanted to do some research.

Also as an aside. I’m using the Its you not your gear house rule. Does the banning of magic items that permanently boost your ability scores extend to belts of ogre strength, gloves of Dex and so forth, or is it mean to only get rid of the ‘tomes of stat-boost?

Cheers gang & happy gaming

Sidekick

oh PS. Frenziek Bezerkers are banned in my games - I can't be stuffed with that class.

 

[Korak]

Barbarians are fun to play, and can be fun to DM too. The mechanics reinforce the undisciplined, passionate flavor of the class. The biggest things to remember would be:

1. Make sure player properly tracks rage duration... the hit point you lose at the end of a rage can often put down a barbarian if he isn't healing in a timely manner.

2. No cha, int, or dex based skills (except Balance, Escape Artist, Intimidate, and Ride) so no tumbling, no hiding or moving silently

3. No command word/spell trigger/spell completion magic item activation/deactivation while raging... no rings of spell storing, no turning haste boots on or off... pretty much, only constant effect or potions are usable.

4. No Combat Expertise

5. Also, one thing many melee "cheese" builds use include only 1 or 2 barbarian levels and then take the extra rage feat one or more times. If you find that distasteful, one house rule I have seen used and liked was raising the pre-reqs from "ability to rage" to ability to rage 2/day.

Now, a side note about your house rule...

Also as an aside. I’m using the Its you not your gear house rule. Does the banning of magic items that permanently boost your ability scores extend to belts of ogre strength, gloves of Dex and so forth, or is it mean to only get rid of the ‘tomes of stat-boost?

I'm not saying it's a bad idea, but I will stress that the game was designed for stat items. They are a fantastic value at the DMG prices, and you might consider adding 25% or 50% to the cost, instead of removing them from the game... or give your players a more generous point buy. Much more than previous editions, 3.0 and 3.5 expect ability scores to escalate beyong the "normal human range." Perhaps you want to give a stat point every 2 levels instead of every 4 and have it represent the characters growth or training (thus innate, and not magical or gear related) and then remove or greatly rarify actual stat boosting items.

 

[FrostedMini1337]

Isn't the you're your character not your gear give you a stat point every other level but increase the cost of stat boosting gear 200%, or is there a welll-know "YYCNYG" rule?

 

[BadMojo]

2. No cha, int, or dex based skills (except Balance, Escape Artist, Intimidate, and Ride) so no tumbling, no hiding or moving silently

I could easily see a Barbarian character build using hide or move silently and still fitting the "flavor" of the class. Just imagine a forest-dwelling barbarian character who uses hide and move silently to hunt game for food. Besides, Conan was a pretty sneaky guy.

As for Cheeze...the Frenzied Berserker Prestige Class.

 

[Goldmoon]

The Forsaker is up there on the cheese-o-meter.

 

[Krelios]

I could easily see a Barbarian character build using hide or move silently and still fitting the "flavor" of the class. Just imagine a forest-dwelling barbarian character who uses hide and move silently to hunt game for food. Besides, Conan was a pretty sneaky guy.

As for Cheeze...the Frenzied Berserker Prestige Class.

You just can't use those during rage. It's not a house rule.

 

[Sidekick]

I'm not saying it's a bad idea, but I will stress that the game was designed for stat items. They are a fantastic value at the DMG prices, and you might consider adding 25% or 50% to the cost, instead of removing them from the game... or give your players a more generous point buy. Much more than previous editions, 3.0 and 3.5 expect ability scores to escalate beyong the "normal human range." Perhaps you want to give a stat point every 2 levels instead of every 4 and have it represent the characters growth or training (thus innate, and not magical or gear related) and then remove or greatly rarify actual stat boosting items.

The It's you not your Gear House Rule (made by some WotC dude) swaps out as they put it "Permanent ability score boost items". In return players get an ability 'up' every even level and a feat at every odd level.

What I was wondering is that if anyone here has used the rule, how did they implement it? Absolutely no stat-boosts or just no tomes?

I don't think it would be too disatrous if we banned all stat boosting items, but at the same time I can't see how having them in would hurt either.

[Edit: hmm upping the price to 200% could be a winner too...[/edit]


Also thanks for the heads up about tracking Rage properly.

I’ll be fully counting that bad-boy down, don’t you worry about it.

 

[Bad Paper]

4. No Combat Expertise

<ahem>
My barbarian with Combat Expertise disagrees wholeheartedly. Just because you can't use the feat during the minute or so per day that you're raging, does not mean that you cannot (or even should not) take the feat. Have you ever seen the AC on these guys? It's pathetic.

And yes, he is a half-orc.

 

[Kurashu]

<ahem>
My barbarian with Combat Expertise disagrees wholeheartedly. Just because you can't use the feat during the minute or so per day that you're raging, does not mean that you cannot (or even should not) take the feat. Have you ever seen the AC on these guys? It's pathetic.

And yes, he is a half-orc.

He meant during a rage.

 

[Korak]

<ahem>
My barbarian with Combat Expertise disagrees wholeheartedly. Just because you can't use the feat during the minute or so per day that you're raging, does not mean that you cannot (or even should not) take the feat. Have you ever seen the AC on these guys? It's pathetic.

And yes, he is a half-orc.

Only stressing what cannot be done while raging, not saying Combat Expertise wasn't a potentially very useful feat. I have had it on raging characters before, too.