Bard is spoiled!

Answering your question quoting someone from the other thread:


Makes perfect sense to me.
None of the bard songs or effects require extended singing to get an effect....why is endurance valued over cunning and nimbleness? You have a stronger yell to make someone heal more?

No previous bard incarnation (in either D&D or literary works) valued their endurance over the above two characteristics.
 

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None of the bard songs or effects require extended singing to get an effect....why is endurance valued over cunning and nimbleness? You have a stronger yell to make someone heal more?

No previous bard incarnation (in either D&D or literary works) valued their endurance over the above two characteristics.

Just because there's no power/effect that requires extended singing , it doesn't have to mean the bard doesn't sing/play while he's not fighting.
 

None of the bard songs or effects require extended singing to get an effect....why is endurance valued over cunning and nimbleness? You have a stronger yell to make someone heal more?
Ah, but you see you need to yell louder for the universe to hear you and respond according to your very whim.
Bards aren't sure why the universe listens to therm but it does. Although, being old the universe is hard of hearing: thus need a stronger yell. :cool:
 



None of the bard songs or effects require extended singing to get an effect....why is endurance valued over cunning and nimbleness? You have a stronger yell to make someone heal more?

No previous bard incarnation (in either D&D or literary works) valued their endurance over the above two characteristics.

Cunning is not represented by wisdom ... the intelligent bard is called cunning. Being wise wouldn't normally be considered a bardic trait.

Besides the connection of con to having powerful lungs, a bard can be connected to toughness in that a bard that puts himself into melee fights is not necessarily swift or strong, but fights nonetheless, and is inspiring in that "plucky and tough" way.

The dextrous bard mostly comes out of (a) the 2nd edition subclass of rogue (b) 3x rewarding dex by using it for weapon finesse, ac, ranged attack spells, etc.

Bard as a rogue variant means he needs dex. However, a bard doesn't necessarily need to be a rogue variant ... he has the intelligence and charisma of a roguish type, but he doesn't necessarily need to be an acrobat or a sneak or a theif. He is a storyteller, musician and deals in magic that fogs the mind and lifts the heart. And to tell stories of great battles and heroics ... you need to survive, so the traits that makes one a survivor, like toughness, are important as well.

EDIT:

Ultimately though, the bard isn't inspiring with CON. His primary stat is charisma, it is what inspires. However, he relies on secondary stats, either his wits (int) or his toughness (con) to keep him and his friends alive.
 


To quote from the WoTC article:

However it isn't saying they are USING the Con to inspire their allies.

A charismatic guy showing how tough they are can be inspiring as well. Similarly, a charismatic guy with good ideas is able to trick his opponents.

Either way, if they weren't charismatic, they wouldn't be that good at what they are trying to do.

Valor, the Con build, means what exactly?

Courage and boldness in battle. Being courageous and being tough sort of go hand in hand. More than strong, fast, smart or wise ...
 

Courage and boldness in battle. Being courageous and being tough sort of go hand in hand. More than strong, fast, smart or wise ...

So, you cannot be courageous without perfect physique and health, and you cannot be inspiring without those qualities either? Those ideals sounds so 30ies... somehow. ;)
 

So, you cannot be courageous without perfect physique and health, and you cannot be inspiring without those qualities either? Those ideals sounds so 30ies... somehow. ;)

Con dosn't necessarily equate to physique. If you aren't that strong or that fast ... you probably don't have a great physique. What would someone with 8 str and 10 dex, but about 18 con look like? I would hardly guess a body builder.

In terms of pro wrestling, something I at least know about ... Mic Foley isn't particularly strong or fast (some would argue smart or wise) ... but he is tough, and he is charismatic. His career is built in part because of his ability to put his body through tons of punishment, and also his ability to connect with the audience. In many ways his mix of charisma, and toughness, was inspiring enough to get the fans to cheer for him.

It is likely EASIER to be courageous if you are able to take a beating ;). Someone that takes a beating, but can keep getting back up has the power to be inspiring.

EDIT:

Your example is someone who is obviously very strong ... but STR is not a primary or secondary stat for a bard. Con doesn't equate to big muscles.

EDIT the second:

The cunning bard has a number of powers that put "kick me" signs on his allies, allowing him to have enemies marked by his allies. It's possible that the valor bard is more of a defender and marks the enemies himself. The defining characteristic of defenders, in addition to marking, is their number of healing surges/ability to take damage and keep going. A bard that is able to be a defender needs to be tough, and it's courageous in that he's going to have lower HP and number of surges than an average defender and thus risking more.
 
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