Bard without spellcasting

[Herzog]

A friend of mine is about to start a new campaign, in which the PC can't take Arcane casting classes.

One of the players wants to play a Bard anyway, and now he's looking for a Bard variant that doesn't have spellcasting.

I already suggested the Divine Bard variant from Unearthed Arcana, and several prestige classes that give bardic music or other, similar abilities without adding spellcasting that he could use, but I haven't been able to find a Bard variant without spellcasting, like the Paladin and Ranger variants from Complete Warrior.

Does anyone know of such a variant?
Since it's probably going to be a Houseruled version otherwise, any (preferably playtested) variants are welcome!

Thanx in advance

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

If you can find it, the Athasian Bard is non-magical (available from athas.org) has come recommended when a question like this pops up, though I've never used it. Unfortunately, athas.org has had some severe technical difficulties over the last year, and doesn't seem to be fully recovered.

There's also this one posted here a few years ago, sort of a cross between a bard and a swashbuckler. I rather like the look of it, but I've never played it either. The version I've got is attached below; I don't remember where this pretty formatted version came from, but it appears to be the same thing, or pretty close to the one in that post.

 

[Dandu]

Rogue/Dread Pirate

 

[Empirate]

Before your friend tries playing a Bard without spells, may I recommend he tries not to suck quite as hard as that?
The Bard variant whose writeup the_orc_within provided is incredibly weak from an optimization standpoint. The little that spell-less Bard gets to make up for losing incredibly useful spells can't hold a candle to... well, those incredibly useful spells!

 

[kitcik]

At least he's not trying a non-casting wizard variant...

Behold! I am a melee specialist with 4 HP, 0 armor, 0 BAB and 1d4 + 0 damage. Fear me!

In all seriousness, though, it's kinda hard for me to imagine how mcuh of a power shift "no arcane casting" would be. Maybe a well-built, spell-less bard would be middle tier...

 

[Rakusia]

wouldnt a spelless bard be like an underpowered rogue?

id just go rogue and take perform on an instrument. still technically a bard or worst case a minstral with few morals

 

[Dandu]

At least he's not trying a non-casting wizard variant...

Behold! I am a melee specialist with 4 HP, 0 armor, 0 BAB and 1d4 + 0 damage. Fear me!

In all seriousness, though, it's kinda hard for me to imagine how mcuh of a power shift "no arcane casting" would be. Maybe a well-built, spell-less bard would be middle tier...

Rogue is tier 4. You'd be about that.

 

[Herzog]

regarding Tier: Since there probably won't be other casting classes, I think it's a safe bet all other classes will be at or around the same Tier. I've provided a link to the Tier system for classes for his reference.

Regarding Estimated Tier of 'linked' class: are you referring to the athas bard or the Bard/Swashbuckler merge?

Just to set things straight:
My friend is the DM. If he feels he needs to add additional power to the class, he can.
The player wanting to play the Bard I don't know. But since he wants to play one regardless of losing spellcasting, he probably is more interested in the bardic music and lore.....

 

[Thanael]

What does he mean by bard? Skald? Minstrel? Performer? Loremaster? Old Lore Bard? Gypsy?
Does he want the bardic music effects? Or only the diplomacy/suave-ness? Is divine spellcasting ok?


Play a
Brd1/RogX/SwashbucklerY (check out the dead levels article for seduce class feature)
Brd1/Brb4/War Chanter X (no spellcasting!)
Brd1/Ftr4/War Chanter X (no spellcasting!)
Ftr/Rog/Brd1/Blade(see below) (conversion of the 2E Blade Kit, no spellcasting!)
Dwarf Brd1/Ftr4/War Chanter2/OllamX
Dwarf CloisteredCleric7/OllamX
Fighter4/Rogue3/Exemplar


The 2E Blade Kit was a spell-less bard performer: Bard Blade Kit conversion thread 1 , Bard Blade Kit conversion thread 2

The Warchanter prc from Complete Warrior increases bardic music but not spellcasting. Only inspire courage is a prereq so a Bard 1 qualifies and has no spellcasting.

Races of Stone has a bardic dwarven teacher prc, Ollam, which increases spellcasting but it's not a prerequisite.

Dread Pirate increases diplomacy and inspire type abilities. Rogues and Swasbucklery types qualify easily.

Evangelist is a sort of fast-talk bardic prestige class that requires no spellcasting.

Purple Dragon Knight gains inspire type abilities.

Exemplar is a skill based prc that makes you better at skills and others too.

The Jester class from Dragon compendium might interest you too.

The Dark Sun Bard from athas.org is a poisoner/performer/rogue hybrid.

Fochlucan Lyricist is a druidic bard loosely inspired by the 1E Bard but increasing arcana and divine spellcasting.

Prestige Class: Dwarven Chanter (Kit Conversion) a 2E bard kit conversion, increases any spellcasting, but has no spellcasting prereqs

Prestige Class: Halfling Whistler (Kit Conversion) a 2E bard kit conversion, increases any spellcasting, but has no spellcasting prereqs

Check out the major fey bloodline from UA.

Cloistered Cleric grants a lore type ability.

The Archivist is a divine full spellcaster with lore type abilities.



How about some fanmade classes/prcs:

The oldschool 1E Old Lore Bard as a 3E prc: http://www.enworld.org/forum/pathfi...thfinder-bard-prestige-class.html#post5116972 (druidic spellcasting)

A fanmade Skald (Bardbarian)

Looking for Spell-less Bard variant thread

 

[Tinker Gnome]

There is the Master class from the Dragonlance War of the Lance sourcebook. It is meant to be a PC version of the Expert, and is based around the Craft, Knowledge, Perform, and Profession skills. Depending on which skill a PC takes as his main one he gets different abilities, so a Master Performer gets similar Song buffing abilities to a Bard. They have medium BAB I believe, so not too bad in the melee department. I do not have my book with me so I can not say much more.