D&D 5E Bardlock vs Sorlock

[Thoughtcandle]

Hey everyone!

So I’m getting ready to start a new campaign soon, and have narrowed my character down to two potential builds:

• 2 hexblade / X bard (probably lore, maybe swords)

• 2 hexblade / X sorcerer (probably clockwork, maybe divine soul - not really intending to abuse coffeelock cheese)

Both of these can fit very well into my characters backstory & flavor, I’m just looking for some insight into these two options and what I can expect from each one since I’ve yet to play any of these classes (no stranger to multi-classing though, and yes I am set on the hexblade dip)

What are advantages + disadvantages and if you’ve played either combo, what was your experience like?

Party composition is small as well, so I’m trying to help make up for our weaknesses.

We’ll have a divination wizard, an arcane trickster, and our DM will have a Paladin NPC baby to help round us out a bit further.

 

[Solarazhade]

Sorry to be a month late to the discussion but I was doing my own research into ways to build a bard so I thought I would let you know what I've learned. Note that most of the importance of my findings revolves around level 10 bard which is level 12 character for you so you probably still have time to apply it if you want.

I think a lot of people don't know how to build a Bard gish because the most important feature that determines if you will be competitive or not is Magical Secrets earned at level 10. The trick to this is when you realize that classes that only go up to level 5 spell casting have comparatively stronger level 5 spells than other classes. Specifically Holy Weapon from the Paladin spell list. What's really crazy is that Bards can get this spell earlier and with more casts per day than Paladins. So it's basically a huge jump in power starting at Bard level 10.

My DPR assumptions are only using sustainable numbers at level 20 so like for College of Swords it assumes a D6 flourish every round rather than a D12, assumes no advantage to hit, no buffs or feats other than what is listed, and is just using mundane weapons. These are baselines and you should expect to almost always be doing more damage than this barring terrible RNG.

2 Hexlock / 1 Fighter / 17 Valor Bard
Hex / Archery / Hand Crossbow / Crossbow Expert / Sharpshooter / Battle Magic / Eldritch Blast / Agonizing Blast
44 DPR Ranged
Char Lvl to achieve DPR: 17

2 Hexlock / 18 Sword Bard
Holy Weapon / Dueling / Spear or Quarterstaff (1h) / Shield / Polearm Master / Defensive Flourish
40 DPR +3-8 AC
Char Lvl to achieve 93% DPR: 12

1 Fighter / 19 Sword Bard
Holy Weapon / Great Weapon Fighting / Glaive/Halberd / Polearm Mastery / Mobile Flourish
43 DPR Reach and Crowd Control
Char Lvl to achieve 93% DPR: 11
*Just including this for reference since I had the data anyway, no real way to combine this with warlock though.

As a point of reference, using my same assumptions above a CBE/SS Fighter would be 47 DPR at Char lvl 20 (since I exclude things like Action Surge) and a sorlock would be 72 dpr at Char lvl 17 though note that a sorlock doesn't scale as much with magic equipment.

While these DPR numbers don't compare to a SorLock or even a straight fighter keep in mind that this is in addition to full spellcasting and gets 93% of it's benefit at level 11 or 12 rather than 17 or 20 (with the exception of the eldritch blast build). Compared to the fighter you'll have insane AOE, mobility, and utility. Compared to the sorlock you'll have more spell slots and skills and can cut the difference down when you get magic weapons. In practice these builds would use 1-3 5th level spell slots per day (depending on how often your other party members want to short rest) to maintain 100% uptime on the benefits.

 

[Neonchameleon]

Hey everyone!

So I’m getting ready to start a new campaign soon, and have narrowed my character down to two potential builds:

• 2 hexblade / X bard (probably lore, maybe swords)

• 2 hexblade / X sorcerer (probably clockwork, maybe divine soul - not really intending to abuse coffeelock cheese)

Both of these can fit very well into my characters backstory & flavor, I’m just looking for some insight into these two options and what I can expect from each one since I’ve yet to play any of these classes (no stranger to multi-classing though, and yes I am set on the hexblade dip)

What are advantages + disadvantages and if you’ve played either combo, what was your experience like?

Party composition is small as well, so I’m trying to help make up for our weaknesses.

We’ll have a divination wizard, an arcane trickster, and our DM will have a Paladin NPC baby to help round us out a bit further.

You haven't said what level you are playing at. (And Hexblade 3 can be really worth grabbing for access to all rituals).

Fundamentally Warlock 2/Sorcerer X comes good at Warlock 2/Sorcerer 9 as a combat monster. The particular synergy is Eldritch Blast and Quicken Spell; Quicken Spell only gives you an extra cantrip - but that's scarily good when that cantrip is Eldritch Blast and really ramps up when you hit level 11; a two-ray Eldritch Blast (with agonizing and Cha 20) does roughly the damage of Scorching Ray (a second level spell) while a three ray Scorching Ray does single target damage roughly on par with the best single target damage fourth level spells like Blight or higher level fireball. Doing this twice in a turn at the cost of a second level spell slot is scary. The Sorcerer is the power choice.

The bard on the other hand is the all rounder; the one thing that is missing from most bards is the ability to bring the damage; they have great skills, amazing utility, and competent healing. Oddly enough you probably don't want to spec into the College of Swords especially at high level; Booming Blade is just as thematic and about as effective unless you get really good magic swords (e.g. a Flame Tongue longsword).

 

[Solarazhade]

Treantmonk posted a build video for a hexblade bard but you wouldn't know it from the title. It's called The Flying Knight.


It's very similar to my spear build but with find greater steed spell and using a lance which later becomes a spear/shield, glaive, or halberd and instead of holy weapon he gets Tenser's Transformation at 14 bard so it comes online a bit later. It's a bit feat hungry so spear/shield seems like a safer choice as you won't be getting GWM/GWF anyway.

The notable benefit though is that your mount also gets the bonuses from tenser's transformation so they are almost more like an animal companion then a mount and can do a lot of damage. You can do the flying mounts he suggested but it's notable that the tiger has a chance to get a bonus action attack in addition to the 2 claw attacks, so it can potentially do higher damage when using tenser's transformation. That being said it's not as sustainable as holy weapon since it takes a 6th level spell slot that you'll only get 1 of before you start cannibalizing your even higher spell slots. Plus it only lasts 10 minutes vs an hour though that is fairly respectable. It's more of a 1 combat a day type of build, with a few more per day at very high levels. If you plan ahead you could probably squeeze a few combats in 1 tenser cast.

Another thing that you can do that I didn't include in the calculation is cast the 9th level spell foresight for advantage to all your attacks. I don't like including it in a baseline calc because it's so easy to get advantage from a lot of different sources that it overstates the benefit from foresight but it is on the bard spell list, lasts 8 hours, and doesn't take concentration. It also has a lot of defensive benefits.