D&D 5E Bards. They are silly. Is there a way to make them NOT silly?

[Baldurs_Underdark]

The only difference between a bard and a great general is that the bard understands rythm and rhyme.

 

[Raith5]

Check out the excellent book Magician's Law (Tales of the Bard #1) by Michael Scott. Paedur the bard is pretty cool dude who is completely humourless and uses lore and stories to convince various people along his way. I think seeing and playing bards as keepers of knowledge rather than musicians or comedians is really important to avoid the trap of the annoying bard stereotype.

 

[Aldarc]

The bard seems like a natural fit for refined nobles in a fantasy setting. It's social-oriented with magical charisma. They have a smattering of education, but better than most, though not necessarily as much (or as well-understood) as the dedicated scholars (e.g. wizards). They have a bit of training in arms and armor, as well as in spells that complement the subtleties of nobility (e.g. enchantment, illusion, etc.). If they are more courtly-oriented nobles, then they may go Lore, insulting and cutting down to size their political foes. But if they are battlefield commanding sorts, then they may go Valor, inspiring their dedicated knights, mercenaries, and troops. They have quips and insights that they have gleaned from their knowledge of stories, lore, and ballads that they know that they can throw out to inspire.

 

[hejtmane]

The only difference between a bard and a great general is that the bard understands rythm and rhyme.

The insping leader would do this

What's he that wishes so?
My cousin Westmoreland? No, my fair cousin;
If we are mark'd to die, we are enow
To do our country loss; and if to live,
The fewer men, the greater share of honour.
God's will! I pray thee, wish not one man more.
By Jove, I am not covetous for gold,
Nor care I who doth feed upon my cost;
It yearns me not if men my garments wear;
Such outward things dwell not in my desires.
But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive.
No, faith, my coz, wish not a man from England.
God's peace! I would not lose so great an honour
As one man more methinks would share from me
For the best hope I have. O, do not wish one more!
Rather proclaim it, Westmoreland, through my host,
That he which hath no stomach to this fight,
Let him depart; his passport shall be made,
And crowns for convoy put into his purse;
We would not die in that man's company
That fears his fellowship to die with us.
This day is call'd the feast of Crispian.
He that outlives this day, and comes safe home,
Will stand a tip-toe when this day is nam'd,
And rouse him at the name of Crispian.
He that shall live this day, and see old age,
Will yearly on the vigil feast his neighbours,
And say 'To-morrow is Saint Crispian.'
Then will he strip his sleeve and show his scars,
And say 'These wounds I had on Crispian's day.'
Old men forget; yet all shall be forgot,
But he'll remember, with advantages,
What feats he did that day. Then shall our names,
Familiar in his mouth as household words-
Harry the King, Bedford and Exeter,
Warwick and Talbot, Salisbury and Gloucester-
Be in their flowing cups freshly rememb'red.
This story shall the good man teach his son;
And Crispin Crispian shall ne'er go by,
From this day to the ending of the world,
But we in it shall be remembered-
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,
This day shall gentle his condition;
And gentlemen in England now-a-bed
Shall think themselves accurs'd they were not here,
And hold their manhoods cheap whiles any speaks
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.

 

[BoldItalic]

The insping leader would do this

What's he that wishes so?
<snip>
That fought with us upon Saint Crispin's day.

Whereas the Bard would sing it and it would sound like something from an Elgar oratorio. Or possibly Benjamin Britten. But not Wagner. Definitely not Wagner.

 

[Tony Vargas]

At present, the bard concept is borderline subclass material for the wizard. -- For myself, that's frustrating because we've seen a recognizable maturation of concept from 1st - 4th editions, so 5th's interpretation feels reductive.

I'm not see'n it. The Lore Bard has the 4e Bard about covered, and the Valor Bard the post-Essentials 4e Bard(Skald).

 

[Wrathamon]

Personally, I *really* just like the notion of reskinning the Bard as "The Adventurer". Replace their musical magic with standard Wizard Focus or Components, replace their Tools options with 1 Musical Instrument and others like Thieves, Herbalist, etc. And treat them like the wonderful mish-mash class they were meant to be, a class that has picked up a few skills from every other class and cobbled them together well enough to survive in a big scary world.

THIS
PLus a bit of the Archivist from 3.5 and someone mentioned truenamer ... ancient words of power. Get rid of the Music and retheme any Song or things that make them sound like their wit is doing something magical. Cunning Words, Countersong, Song of Rest, etc get rethemed. Remove music instruments as their focus, remove the need or just let them use their words of ancient knowledge for a lore bard, or sword weaving for a Blade Bard, or be like William Wallace and inspire those around you with words and presence. (you could leave them as tools choices for players who like music and they can use it to fool people in where their magic comes from)

Make it the educated adventurer that trains in a school or from a master ... Collage of Blade, Collage of Lore, Collage of War, Collage of Shadow, etc. Mysterious guilds/schools

I agree I think the music/comedy stuff is dumb imo

 

[Wrathamon]

Bards inspire their companions when things are bad. They know ancient lore and great secrets. They often cast utility spells more than combat spells, and their spells often focus on imagery, trickery, and knowledge rather than combat. They, or at least some of them, often engage in melee alongside the fighters.

Hmm. You know who that sounds like? Sounds to me an awful lot like Gandalf.

If you don't like the class as written (and it's not actually written nearly as music-focused as people think, but even if it was), you can do an awful lot by just tweaking the flavor a bit but keeping the mechanics as they are.

(PS: Yes, I know, Gandalf and the other wizards weren't actually human, blah-blah-blah. Not the point.)

Gandalf must not have taken many knowledge skills or his int is low cause he forgets everything it seems or he is an unlucky player who rolls bad when Int checks come up

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I think the music/comedy stuff is dumb

Well, it does have historical roots.

Before languages were written, knowledge was passed along orally. Your historians, your lore-masters, would have had prodigious amounts of stuff memorized for the good of society. And often, poetry and/or music was used as a mnemonic device. You'll see traces of it in all epics- the Kalevala, the Iliad, the Bible all have passages where cadence & repetition are key not only to the story before you, but also to other events within the same work. Some sections are just more obvious bout it than others.

 

[Ilbranteloth]

First of all, relevant comic.

Secondly, I love the heck out of bards. Mechanically, I think they knock it out of the ballpark. Conceptually, I even think that a jack of all trades character is a cool conceit. Bards conjure up images of Kvothe Kingkiller, Thomdril Merrilin, and even historical figures like Sir Richard Francis Burton. Unfortunately, it never goes like that in game. Bards have an image problem, and your badass character concept never survives contact with a sniggering table full of gamers singing "Brave Sir Robin."

My question is this: How do you play a bard seriously? It's admittedly silly to imagine someone breaking out the tambourine and "inspiring you with the dance of my people" during an orc attack. So what do you do instead? How do you dispel all those goofy heavy metal, El Kabong, glam rocker, nerdy dude in tights tropes and create a bard character that actually belongs in a heroic fantasy? And more importantly, how do you convince the rest of the table to take your bard seriously?

Actually, at our table they're usually like Alan-a-Dale or Chaucer from A Knight's Tale.