Blatant abuse of the five foot step?

[reveal]

I would actually encourage my players to be this creative and cinematic

No doubt. In my last game, my wife played a halfling who was under 4' tall. They were in water that was 4' tall, so just over her head. They were fighting large critters so she would jump up, fire with her bow, and then go back under the water. I ruled some penalties on the fly and it was really, really cool.

 

[Infiniti2000]

I would not allow it based essentially on what dcollins said. You cannot take a 5ft-step for a mode of movement in which you do not have a listed speed. So, you cannot take a 5ft-step into air. You can step off the edge, but that's actual movement, not merely a combat adjustment.

 

[SBMC]

Falling is a free action. So, he takes a 5' step to go over the edge and then faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllssssssssss. Heck, he could fall 240' and that wouldn't count as his move. Of course, he would take a lot of damage when he hit the ground.

In this case, I would let him do it. He takes a 5' step and fires while falling with a penalty, probably -4 or -8. It would look really cool.

Reveal is right here. If he took a five foots step into a pit you would not charge him a move action for the fall - "falling is free".

Otherwise, following the logic stated, when you fall that 60' per round (I think it is - if not say it is for the purposes of this example)) would that then count as a double move for the character with a 30' move? No - it would not.

Page 77 of the PHB (middle/lower right hand side) details this: See Jumping Down and Action. It indicates that jumping is a move equivalent action (and/or combined with a move action) and Jumping down falls under Jumping - thus it is an actual move equivalent action - and thus you cannot also make a full attack. Elsewhere in the Jump skill description it indicates the DC's for falling prone.

In other words if he wants he cannot step 5', fall and make a full attack in the same round. He may however:
1. Jump down, fall and make a single attack
2. Make a single attack, jump down and fall
3. Make a full attack and just step 5' and end his turn in midair (see below)

Regarding number 3 - On his next turn: The falling is "free". Trying to stay upright when landing I would also call a move action: I think the Jump skill description supports that though not as directly as I would like.

However, between the PC's turns of stepping and falling (seeing as he also attacked them), the badguys would see him coming and on their turn, after he took his step into midair, could do bad things.

• I would call falling on someone a charge (a free charge for the guy falling - but he can't benefit from it with an attack as a charge unless he chooses to do so at some penalty; but recall this also means he can't use an action to stay upright seeing as a charge is a full round action).
• The enemy could set weapons against that charge on their turn. Meaning the PC takes the falling damage PLUS damage from the set weapons.
• I would also say that, given we live in a 3 dimensional world, the PC would generate AoO's for any threatened squares he passes through; be they in midair.

Thoughts?

 

[reveal]

Falling

Falling Damage

The basic rule is simple: 1d6 points of damage per 10 feet fallen, to a maximum of 20d6.

If a character deliberately jumps instead of merely slipping or falling, the damage is the same but the first 1d6 is nonlethal damage. A DC 15 Jump check or DC 15 Tumble check allows the character to avoid any damage from the first 10 feet fallen and converts any damage from the second 10 feet to nonlethal damage. Thus, a character who slips from a ledge 30 feet up takes 3d6 damage. If the same character deliberately jumped, he takes 1d6 points of nonlethal damage and 2d6 points of lethal damage. And if the character leaps down with a successful Jump or Tumble check, he takes only 1d6 points of nonlethal damage and 1d6 points of lethal damage from the plunge.

Falls onto yielding surfaces (soft ground, mud) also convert the first 1d6 of damage to nonlethal damage. This reduction is cumulative with reduced damage due to deliberate jumps and the Jump skill.

Emphasis mine. By the RAW, a character cannot take a 5' step and fall. They must make a Jump check or they can simply slip and fall. By the RAW, there is no "walk into open air" because it only mentions jumping or slipping. So the character in question can make a full attack and then do nothing, make a single attack and jump, or jump and make a single attack while falling.

With that said, I would still allow it because it would be really cool.

 

[anon]

Reveal, I don't see how the quote supports your conclusion.

It basically states what happens if you deliberately jump. I would guess the character would say that they are not deliberately jumping, but that they are deliberately falling and would willingly give up the benefit of deliberate jumping (the first 1d6 count as non-lethal damage).

I believe this question was asked above is a slightly different from, but how would you rule if there was an illusionary floor which extended 5 feet beyond the actual edge of the drop-off. Would the character "float" at the end of their turn? Would you not permit the movement?

 

[reveal]

Reveal, I don't see how the quote supports your conclusion.

It basically states what happens if you deliberately jump. I would guess the character would say that they are not deliberately jumping, but that they are deliberately falling and would willing give up the benefit of deliberate jumping (the first 1d6 count as non-lethal damage).

I believe this question was asked above is a slightly different from, but how would you rule if there was an illusionary floor which extended 5 feet beyond the actual edge of the drop-off. Would the character "float" at the end of their turn? Would you not permit the movement?

The quote supports it because of what it doesn't say. It does not say you can walk, it only says you can jump or slip. If you're going by RAW, you have to go by what is written.

And if a character walks 5' forward onto an illusory floor, they would start falling immediately because falling is a free action. They walk 5' because it's a surface, the character at least believes it's a real surface, and is allowable.

 

[Miln]

The quote supports it because of what it doesn't say. It does not say you can walk, it only says you can jump or slip. If you're going by RAW, you have to go by what is written.

The rules could be read to say that you can do three thinks: jump, slip, or fall.

Also the sentence is only telling you what happens when someone jumps instead of doing X. That in no way means that doing X is the only other possibility.

 

[TheEvil]

I would be inclinded to say that the amount of psyching youself up that would be required to step off a ledge into open space, knowing that it is going to hurt alot on the other end, would preclude using a 5' adjustment. Just because the player knows that the fall is something the character will survive doesn't mean that the character wouldn't be somewhat leary about it.

As far as interpreting the RAW, I am torn. I am inclinded to agree that open air isn't a valid square to 5' step into, much like rough terrain isn't.

 

[William_2]

“If a character deliberately jumps instead of merely slipping or falling,”

I don’t think this means that a character can’t deliberately move into a position that results in a fall – falling is not defined as only accidental here. So, I think a character can five foot step into a space that results in a fall, with the appropriate damage as listed.
Whether they can do anything on the way down depends to me on how much of their turn the fall takes up. Someone falling for a full six seconds could indeed take some action, I think.
What if they take the time for a full attack before the step, though – how much time would they actually spend falling that round?

In the example, I think it is pretty simple: a character so few feet up would step off and hit the ground in a matter of an instant, with virtually no possibility of doing anything on the way down. They would face AoOs from any whose threatened space (vertical or horizontal) they left in the course of falling, and end prone and slightly injured. They would still have their turn other than the step at that point, however, and could use a move action to stand up (taking relevant AoOs), and make a single attack.
The much better alternative is clearly taking the full attack, and then stepping and falling, ending their round prone.

Taking a full attack during such a very short fall is not so much cinematic to me as cartoonish. Just doesn’t do it for me. Someone who is falling a substantial distance, for sure, that would be cool. As a DM, I would tend to make this attempt turn out comically, rather than anything else – it is just too much of a stretch, and while I applaud the general idea of heroic efforts, you have to try and let reality intrude a bit, I think. I would have the character hit the ground while attempting a full attack, and be able to stand and make a single attack.

 

[Bastoche]

Two stories is about 20ft high. I would accept it if the attacks are made first and the 5 foot step after. After the end of his turn, he's in matrix-like mid air. So anyone on the roof could still attack him. On his next turn, he would get the d6 damage for falling and would automatically lose a MEA due to the 20ft drop. Similar to the jump rulling. No way he would get a free 20ft move. The fall takes time (jump off a 8ft high roof and count in your head. It's about 1-2 seconds. Falling 20ft sure takes about 3-4 seconds, the time for a MEA and/or half a move). I would then require a balance and/or tumble check (standard action) to see if the guy is prone. Then that round would be over.