BoEF- A meaured response

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Belen

Legend
I felt a need to speak out in opposition; however, I do not want to start a flame war. Rather, I just want to mention what thebook means to me and how I perceive it, so I hope that people can leave the name calling aside and discuss this in a polite manner.

First, the fact that both you and Mr. Valterra remain attached to WOTC only proves that Valar is not the independent company that you'd like us to believe. Since, AV mentioned starting a private label run by WOTC but for mature products, I see no reason to believe that this is not connected.

Second, how will you keep this material away from kids? It will be impossible to keep gaming material out of the hands of children. Many 18 year old high school students play with kids of younger age. I am certain that they will see no trouble in excepting the money of friends to buy the DnD porn book. You may not care if chidren get the material of not, but as a person living under the rule of the preachers in the bible belt, I have an interest in not seeing public railing against our hobby from the pulpit! Yes, demon-worship may be passe these days, but you are tapping right into the biggest fear among parents: sex.

Third, the book does not even have the good taste to use fantasy art. Whereas many parents may ignore cartoon pictures, I guarantee you that real models will make them look twice. It will be REAL nudity. How can you justify this? What place does eroticism have in a game?

Fourth, the BoEF will only serve to heighten the gamer stereotype of nerds playing the parents basements. It will serve to fuel the image that a bunch of guys with no social life and an inability to get a girlfriend, play this game. It is a stereotype that I have worked against for a decade. It has been bad enough trying to get past people's beliefs and let them see the truth. Most people will see this book and never even take the time to listen!

I am not telling anyone that they cannot make sex part of their game. That is for each group to decide on their own. In fact, the GMs should be the one's making the material! It is a game of imagination afterall. Why do we need RULES for sex? Did you ever consider that by turning sex into a die roll that you are lessening it in real life? Kids who get this book will not truly respect the act if they are "experienced" with in game sex!Because it will be teens, especially virgins who finds this book to be the most desireable.

I am sure that some people will rail against me and bandy names such as troll and puritan. However, it is MY image that concerns me. I love the game of DnD and I hate that I have defend myself, my morality and my honor from people because of the existing stereotype. For those of you who want to say that this book will have no effect, that I am a doomsayer, or that I should not try to censure others for what they do in their private homes, then you are not seeing the point of my argument.

I have no desire to control what you do in your own group. You can still DO it. We do not need a public set of rules for ertocia in DnD. This is simplely a move to create controversy in order to sell a product: DnD.

The only thing that I can do is write Hasbo and WOTC and let them know what I think. In fact, I will be sending multiple letters, including a petition started by my players and circulating around the local game shops and universities. I did not fight the BoVD, but I will not go quietly into the darkness on this issue.
 
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I too feel the need to speak out!

What I want to know is how can we keep Dungeons & Dragons rulebooks away from kids? It will be impossible to keep gaming material out of the hands of children. You may not care if chidren get the material of not, but as a person living under the rule of the preachers in the bible belt, I have an interest in not seeing public railing against our hobby from the pulpit! Yes, demon-worship may be passe these days, but you are tapping right into the biggest fears among parents: theft, violence, and murder.

How can you justify this? What place does crime and bloodshed have in a game?

D&D will only serve to heighten the gamer stereotype of "trenchcoat mafia" kids with trigger-happy fingers. It will serve to fuel the image that a bunch of sociopathic guys play this game. It is a stereotype that I have worked against for a decade. It has been bad enough trying to get past people's beliefs and let them see the truth. Most people will see these books and never even take the time to listen!

I am not telling anyone that they cannot make crime and violence a part of their game. That is for each group to decide on their own. In fact, the GMs should be the one's making the material! It is a game of imagination afterall. Why do we need RULES for robbing and killing people? Did you ever consider that by turning crime into a die roll that you are lessening it in real life? Kids who get this book will not truly respect the act if they are "experienced" with in game murder! Or is this a liberal political agenda to bring more people around to your viewpoint by targeting people at a young age? Because it will be teens, especially angry young misfits who finds this book to be the most desireable.

I am sure that people will rail against me and bandy names such as troll and hippy. However, it is MY image that concerns me. I love Hasbro's less offensive card games and boardgames (except for Clue which is very inappropriate) and I hate that I have defend myself, my morality and my honor from people because of the existing stereotype. For those of you who want to say that this book will have no effect, that I am a doomsayer, or that I should not try to censure others for what they do in their private homes, then you are not seeing the point of my argument.

I have no desire to control what you do in your own group. You can still DO it. We do not need a public set of rules for burglary and murder in D&D. This is simply a move to create controversy in order to sell a product: D&D. I know that you do not care how we, the players, appear to others. You're in it for the money, but I do wish that you'd considered that angle.

The only thing that I can do is write you and let you know what I think. In fact, I will be sending multiple letters, including a petition started by my players and circulating around the local game shops and universities. I did not fight TV, movies, and video games, but I will not go quietly into the darkness on this issue.

Squirrel Nutkin
 

http://enworld.cyberstreet.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=868826#post868826

Do we really not only need more threads on this subject but also for you to post virtually the same thing in all of them? Do you not see how this could be rather annoying to your fellow board members, the mods and anyone with any sense at all? I will tell you this once...

Please click on the link in the lower right hand portion of your post and report yourself now. It is your only hope!
 

You know, I seem to recall your last topic you opened on this subject was darned near identical in content (if not tone), and it was deleted.

There are already threads on this. Three, at least. Why do you feel the need to start a new one?
 

Squirrel,

Personally, I think that was wrong, man. I have no desire to start a flame war, so I will refrain from dropping down to the level you wish, but if you have a point then you should write it yourself instead of plagarizing someone else's words.

We all have a write to our own viewpoint. Ye gods, this is why I do not like messageboards.

Dave
 


And, furthermore, if you absolutly *must* open a new topic, at least keep the political stuff out of it, m'kay? That's one of the big no-nos on this board... "Though shalt not delve into politics".

Personaly, I won't debate the actual content of the post until it's in one of the established threads.
 

BelenUmeria said:
We all have a write to our own viewpoint.
I agree. And as somebody who feels that violence is wrong and sex is not, I think I just made my own viewpoint crystal clear. ;)

PS: So, are we going to have this exact same conversation in a third thread, or can we stick with the two we've already got? All this cutting and pasting is making me dizzy! :p
 

BelenUmeria said:
Squirrel,

Personally, I think that was wrong, man. I have no desire to start a flame war, so I will refrain from dropping down to the level you wish, but if you have a point then you should write it yourself instead of plagarizing someone else's words.

We all have a write to our own viewpoint. Ye gods, this is why I do not like messageboards.

Dave

I didn't see a flame there at all. I saw a parallel argument drawn that would call into question the validity of your own.
 

Ah heck, I give up. I do not know why I try to have serious discussions anyway. Anywho, I should get to work.
 

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