Book of Nine Swords -- okay?

[Piratecat]

This new paradigm exists in both the Complete Scoundrel (skill tricks) and Dungeonscape (the Factotum) as well.

EDIT - Shazman beat me to it, and more eloquently as well!

 

[FireLance]

As I play D&D (since forever ago until today), one of the issues that crops up is how the heros we play compare to the heros we read about in books (or see in movies, should I ever have time for such things). Gandalf comes to mind. When did he ever run out of magic?

Boy, does that bring back memories...

When I first looked through a copy of the Basic D&D rules, more than 20 years ago, I remember thinking to myself, a 1st-level magic-user gets to cast just one spell for the entire day? What's he supposed to do the rest of the time?

To someone whose previous experience with magic systems was with point-based computer games like Ultima and gamebooks like Fighting Fantasy, the concept of being able to create only a single spell effect every day was a massive culture shock.

That's why to me, the current culture shock at abilities that do not run out or (at least) are easily refreshed or regained is an almost surreal reversal. I guess it's because the conventional paradigm in D&D seems to have been: mundane stuff you can do as often as you like, but magic must be rationed.

As for heroes never being put at a disadvantage, I think the way to challenge the PCs is to change the nature of the problems they face from "Do I have enough of limited resource X?" to "Do I have the right tool for the job, and if not, how do I get it?" All the fireballs in the world won't help you against a red dragon.

 

[Shazman]

You don't? Tolkien's characters, at least, seem to camp a lot.

They camp to get some rest or shelter from the elements. They don't retreat in the middle of a big battle to "heal up" and "prepare spells."

 

[pawsplay]

They camp to get some rest or shelter from the elements. They don't retreat in the middle of a big battle to "heal up" and "prepare spells."

That's mainly because healing magic in Tolkien takes a while. While mages probably don't prepare spells, keep in mind that most of the spellcasters in LOTR cast spells only rarely and practically never use the same spell twice.

 

[Sithobi1]

They didn't need to retreat in the middle of big battles. The DMPC, DM's best friend who gets nice stuff, Deus Ex Machina, and running away to end a battle worked well enough.

 

[Henry]

Unless the DM gives us some leeway, this extremely enjoyable campaign is about to end in a TPK thanks to the x per day design of the game.

Personally, I'd say that it's about to end because the DM's not giving leeway, not because of the X per day aspect. There are people complaining now about how a character goes from 1st to 20th in the space of three campaign weeks; how about in the same darned day!?!?!

This is probably better discussed elsewhere than a rules thread, though, so I'll bow out. The mechanics, though, are some pretty good ones, and other than some reservations with the front-loading of the warblade's abilities (Felon's always covered that one better than I do), the abilities themselves I don't really mind or find dramatically too powerful.

 

[Henry]

...I think the way to challenge the PCs is to change the nature of the problems they face from "Do I have enough of limited resource X?" to "Do I have the right tool for the job, and if not, how do I get it?" All the fireballs in the world won't help you against a red dragon.

No, but that Mountain Hammer that gives you an extra greatsword's-worth of damage and negates his DR might help a heck of a lot.

 

[RigaMortus2]

There are people complaining now about how a character goes from 1st to 20th in the space of three campaign weeks; how about in the same darned day!?!?!

That would be an extreme example that the DM has full control over. The player's do not control how many encounters they have each day, the DM does. And that is part of the problem, I feel. It's hard to plan and reserve your resources if you don't know if you are going to have 1 encounter or 10 encounters.

I think the ToB system (as well as the others mentioned) helps tilt this "problem" in the player's favor. Remember, it is the DM that controls how many encounters the party will run into on a given day...

One last thing... ToB won't help much in the way of healing, so that IS a resource that will run out and force players to rest/heal. The Devoted Spirit maneuvers that heal are not something you can depend on or use to replace healing magic.

 

[RigaMortus2]

No, but that Mountain Hammer that gives you an extra greatsword's-worth of damage and negates his DR might help a heck of a lot.

Which, at most, can only be used once every other round... Plus it generally is not a good idea to get into melee with a Red Dragon (at least, not for an extended period of time).

 

[Nail]

That's mainly because healing magic in Tolkien takes a while.

The fact that Tolkien's characters camp has very little to do with healing magic!

Tolkien's characters camp because .....<wait fer it!>.....it's the end of the day!