Books pricing themselves out of reach?

I've course I haven't bought a _WotC_ hardback since the 3.0 Psionics Handbook.. *ugh* :(

...I've occasionally flirted w getting 3.5 MM & DMG, but my 3.0 versions with 3.5 PHB seem to do ok, and I hate the 3.5 take on eg Pit Fiends as CR 20, tougher than traditional Arch-Devils and incompatible with 3rd-party product. Pit Fiends should be CR 13 IMO, and the 3.0 version fits my game much better. 3.0 demons likewise (once I lower the listed CRs to be in line w their actual stats).
 

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Bah. I don't like PDFs (my computer is clunky, and no printer, so..), and I don't really give a crap about LGS (be they F or not), so Discount on-line stores all the way. And I buy very few books, and manage a decent game. So price is not that bad. Granted, there's stuff I'd -like- to buy, but I don't -need- to buy it, so I don't.
 

JoeGKushner said:
But the problem here, is Warhammer is much more like a CGC than a RPG. As a matter of fact, they dropped and licensed out their RPG to Hogshead who eventually dropped it and is now being done with Green Ronin and the Black Library. Apples and Oranges no?

I'm not sure I agree. Warhammer is closer to a CCG than an RPG, but the point is that it has a high-cost of investment for the game, and a continuing one at that. Furthermore, from my (very limited) experience, the cost of most warhammer minis is fairly inelastic. The big difference between an RPG book and many of the other entertainment examples, however, is directly attributable cost.

That is to say that a movie, video game and miniature generally have very straightforward fixed costs of production...while the main part of an RPG book, like a fiction book, has difficult costs to quantify. Not every author is as swift or proflific as a Stephen King or Isaac Asimov. Which is more valuable: Wolves of the Cala, A New Spring or A Feast for Crows? Which one cost more to produce? The only real way to gauge is by previous sales and writer's contracts...how easy or difficult it was for the writer to actually write it isn't reflected in the costs, afaik. For example, I may consider a work by Mike Mearls to be worth more than Bruce Cordell...but did it cost more for one to write an article about Psionics than the other? What if I changed it to Ryan Nock or Ben Durbin?
 

Miyazawa Mizaki said:
Where I live the only 2 places you can buy them cost at least $49.99, I know its becuase of the exchange rate but look at it this way: The actual exchange on a $35 US book is only $42.08 canadian dollars, its then marked up $6.91 becuase the place that sells them has a monopily then add the 8% PST and 7% GST and we have the $35 US book costing $57.49 CND, thats $15.41 more than the exchange rate. Oh and alot of people can't buy book online due to age vs. credit card reasons so thats out of the question.

Even so, if you want AE then, you're not going to be paying $50 American, but like $75 Canadania yes? So WoTC is still the lesser expensive of the companies.

I'm not saying that WoTC books are better, but people keep pointing to them being the cost leaders and there are many other companies selling d20 books for more. (Iron Kingdoms books are both 400 pages hardcover at $40 bones. Good deal but still more expensive than most WoTC books no?)
 

KaosDevice said:
Well this thread has hit upon many an issue in the current State of the RPG Market World:
(correct me if you think I am wrong, knowing you probably will)

1. The average ENworlder feels the cost of the production of the books vs. the charge for the books are completely at odds.

2. ENworlders are migrating towards PDF format for more smaller content rather then buying some slipshod bound material off a shelf.

3-Matt C.

Well, just to repeat, it is the bottom end of the market that disapeared--or at least went to PDF, and it is exactly the people who hang at EnWorld that are buying all these hardbacks. As other threads on how many books you have or recent purchases etc have confirmed.

My biggest problem is not cost as much as time to read and storage space. But cost is an issue. In any case, I know I spend a lot less then other EnWorlders.
 

HiLiphNY said:
Laff - this coming from the guy who was $250 bid on the recent eBay auctions. . . I love it in my biz when someone says they won't pay up for stock, yet then turns around and buys it through me 2 points higher at a later date.

Ummm. did i buy it?

it sold for $1524


i love it when a guy doesn't follow thru on something. :p


i bid $400 or something for Russ (the guy who runs ENWurld) collection. i came in second on that bid. did he sell me the stuff. no. not even after the first guy didn't pay.

i have a cutoff for all items.

the $30 tag was for new books being produced. i won't pay $30. i'll just look at them at that price. and then buy them for $20 or less. if it is over $30. it had better give me a handj.. i mean it had better do something more special.
 


WizarDru said:
I'm not sure I agree. Warhammer is closer to a CCG than an RPG, but the point is that it has a high-cost of investment for the game, and a continuing one at that. Furthermore, from my (very limited) experience, the cost of most warhammer minis is fairly inelastic. The big difference between an RPG book and many of the other entertainment examples, however, is directly attributable cost.

Your not sure you agree but do not that Warhammer is closer to a CCG? Okay... The big difference in Warhammer, AFAIK, is that they actively support the hobby with places to play, tournaments and other big events. Fans have a huge impact on the settings via games. Once again, more like a CGC than a RPG. Outside of the RPGA, which is rarely brought up here, where can you play? Your house or your friend's hosue. Ther'es no 'community' to speak where you can share your 'painted miniatures' or a secondary market where what you do with your miniatures can raise their initail value. Outside of some RPGs going out of print and becoming collector's items, most RPG's go down, significantly in price after you buy them.

In addition, while this part may seem strange, part of the hobby, the painting and collecting of miniatures, can occur in a void. You don't need another single soul to paint up a figure.

You also don't have to buy the whole goat in one setting. You can spend as much or as little as you want. Try getting a Player's Handbook with just the 'core rules' without spells or classes. Can't be done. Want a pack of dwarven troll killers or a gyrocopter but not a unit of Whitebeards? No problem.

Once again, apples to oranges.

WizarDru said:
That is to say that a movie, video game and miniature generally have very straightforward fixed costs of production...while the main part of an RPG book, like a fiction book, has difficult costs to quantify. Not every author is as swift or proflific as a Stephen King or Isaac Asimov. Which is more valuable: Wolves of the Cala, A New Spring or A Feast for Crows? Which one cost more to produce? The only real way to gauge is by previous sales and writer's contracts...how easy or difficult it was for the writer to actually write it isn't reflected in the costs, afaik. For example, I may consider a work by Mike Mearls to be worth more than Bruce Cordell...but did it cost more for one to write an article about Psionics than the other? What if I changed it to Ryan Nock or Ben Durbin?

Oh. So when a movie goes overbudget, they increase the ticket price or something? I'm a little confused by what this last point is supposed tu actually mean. For example, your author question, I imagine that there is a very real cost to hire one author over the other. We're not talking Dragon magazine with fixed rates per word (which changes once again, depending on how experienced and well known you are.), we're talking about a specific product with a specific author. Heck, might as well throw in illustrators, editors, and layout specialist as some companies have prooven superiority in that field to others.
 

Exchange

I see it in both RPG books and Paperbacks. When the $ Cdn. is low, the price of books goes up. When the $ Cdn. is high, prices -don't- go down. I hate it.

On another note, I only have 3e PHB, DMG, MM, MM2, MotP and D&Dg, as well as recently I bought the Draconomicon. I have a rule that I only buy gaming books at my FLGS, though I buy most of my magazines at Chapters (which is more convenient, especially when I didn't have my G2 and had to rely on my parents for transportation). Over the years, there were many books I wanted to get, but when I couldn't afford them, they became less important... FF, BoVD, BoED, SS, SBG ( though I may still get that one, if it's available ).

It's a pain, if D&D books were $30 Cdn., I would probably spend substantially more money on them than I have so far.
 

A lot of D&D books are around $31 (CA) on Amazon.ca. Buy two, and you've got free shipping. Those that are more expensive sometimes get cheaper as time (and lack of sales) goes on.
 

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