Bottom 5 D&D and D20 items

[Psion]

I hear you Psion, but when the author himself says in an interview that the Outrider BAB thing was a "conscious decision" and that he was "Trying to do something different"...well, what exactly are you supposed to think?

Yes, that was quite annoying.

However...

It was a Power-Up book when we had been told the cycle of "Complete {whatever} Power-Up Books would not begin again under the new guard".

I do not agree that it was a power up book. Sorry, no sale. It is a very good book with lots of useful information that gets used constantly.

Just like the questions say, if you don't like something/think it's too powerful to you (and I have come to the conclusion that "too powerful" is ultimately a personal determination), don't use it! Take out mercurial swords and ninja of the crecent moon, and there is still a rich selection of material in the book to use. (For that matter I never had that big of an issue with mercurial swords -- my players typically don't take exotic weapons. And I actually think they went overboard with the bladed gauntlet in the errata, making it a weapon NOBODY would take...)

Something about a few bad apples not spoiling the bunch comes to mind.

 

[Mortaneus]

And I actually think they went overboard with the bladed gauntlet in the errata, making it a weapon NOBODY would take...)

It lives again! Check out the Arm Claws spellware in the Dragonstar Galaxy Guide. Sheesh...

 

[kingpaul]

Stronghold Builder's Guidebook didn't impress me, but some of my players liked it. (shrug). Seems mechanically solid enough. Just seems boring to me.

I liked this book. All the detail that you can put into a fantasy castle. The accompanying Dragon (Dungeon?) issue that came out with its release was good as well.

 

[Desdichado]

Where? It sure ain't on ENWorld.

It was yesterday.

 

[Tyler Do'Urden]

Stuph that Sux0rs:

5. The Penumbra products. I just can't stand their modules.

4. Defenders of the Faith. I thought it was a bad idea to try to encorporate the Greyhawk pantheon into the core D&D rules to begin with- and this book made even less sense than that move did. And I still can't figure out what the purpose of many of the prestige classes is... such as that of the (terribly unbalanced) Hospitaler.

3. Deities and Demigods- See #4. Not very useful to most campaigns, I'd wager... unless your players are into crank-calling Loki.

2. Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil. Mainly because of the fact that two of my players have read the module from cover to cover, and I'll never get a chance to run it with them. Bah... it's just another overblown hackfest anyway. It doesn't even have the coolness factor of Return to the Tomb of Horrors (then again, what does...)

1. The Epic Level Handbook. This is the Mein Kampf of D&D... it's the most evil book ever written. Every last copy of it should be hunted down and burned. Or maybe I'm just saying this because secretly, deep down, I hunger the evil power of that wretched tome. (I hear it calling out to me... GIVE IN, GIVE IN!) Or not.

(Wonders if anyone saw his top 10 list... )

 

[Garmorn]

Ok, now I know I am strange. My worst three are:

Creature Colection (S&S). Riddled with problems related to its early release.

Rituals and Relics: Lots of over powered spells and very unappealing prestige classes . Just look at the summoner. +1 spell casting every level and a Metamagic feat every second level. Every second level a bonus spell casting slot of a summoning spell. WAY over the top.

 

[yeebarr]

Okay! I know I'm coming in late in this thread (please bear with me - I just logged in; my first message board chat - EVER!)

I'm glad that the tone this thread has settled down; this is too intersting a thread to get shut down (I think it’s like going to a bar and chatting about what sucks…only to find the guy who designed it is sitting right behind you – oops!)

I only have a couple of books I've been disappointed with.

I guess the products that are consided the "worst" are probably modules/books out there that you thought were going to be great and just didn’t live up to the expectations. I’m not trying to say the module sucked or anything (the guys that write this stuff can probably pick boogers which have more talent than what’s in my brain)…there just books that you sat down to read thinking “wow! These is gonna be cool!” and ended up putting down going “man! I don’t think this was for me…”

My books of "denied" expectations are:

HERO BUILDERS HANDBOOK
After years in the “wilderness” I really thought that this book would be a great way to introduce myself back into the D&D world (having only played basic D&D and that was some 15+ years ago). What was I expecting? I guess I don’t really know. Maybe I was hoping that it’d explain more about feats, skills, prestige classes (and some nice examples), equipment and roleplaying in the world of D&D in general (not asking for much am I?) In the end it felt like they were giving snippets of general information but it was so vague and bland that I felt annoyed that I paid good money (my first purchase after the PHB) for information I could have got from simply chatting with you fine folks on the D&D message boards.

SONG AND SILENCE
I’m playing a rouge halfling (why? Well I wanted to play a halfling…and the PHB said the rogue was the favoured class – sounded like good advice to me!) and yet nothing in the book really jumped out at me as something useful to add to my character. My rogue is a rogue only in the “rascal” sense (he isn’t a thief and he ain’t gonna join any thieves guilds anytime soon!) but all the classes didn’t seem to suit either my combination of halfling and non-thief type character. I know that no book can cover for everybody…but I was disappointed nonetheless.
(On a side note: I’m very interested to see if Bad Axe games - with their “favoured class-multiclass” prestige class characters - will come up with something I may be able to use. Go you BadAxe!)

BOOK OF ELDRITCH MIGHT (I AND II)
Ok before I get flamed on this one I’m sort of just joking about these books! (Just seeing if anyone is still paying attention to me. No? Okay then…) My only problem is I haven’t yet learnt the rules for spell casting (hey! The PBH is a big freakin’ book people!) and I bought these books simply because I kept hearing what a fantastic rules-master Monte Cook is (yes – I am easily peer persuaded – so shush)! So I guess my only disappointment with these books are the fact that I don’t understand a lot of what they’re saying!

Phew - long rant (common problem I suppose for a first time chatter)! Thanks for those that bothered to read this!

 

[MerricB]

The five worst supplements/adventures for d20 don't get bought because no gaming store orders them in the first place.

I can say how disappointed I was with the rules problems in Rob Kuntz's Maze of Zayene series, but I like the rest of the modules, so they're not a total loss.

I can say how disappointed I was with the Enemies & Allies book, because I was looking for basically lists of NPC stats like in the DMG, but that's just a personal thing.

This thread really is "What are the worst supplements of the best?", because you really don't see the worst. Not unless you're a reviewer determined to look at a wide variety of products. I'm sure Psion and other reviewers know far more BAD products than we see.

The classbooks are bizarre: in general, you'll only use a small proportion of those books in play. Perhaps one or two prestige classes, and a handful of feats.

The Core Book are just so useful (and underpriced, comparatively), they distort everything else.

Cheers!

 

[Rashak Mani]

- The DM screen: Is by far the worse I think... its the only screen no one uses the info on it ! Very confusing and badly located stuff... good for blocking the view of players only.

- Psionics: Looks like remashed Magic with very similar feats and effects... total turn off for me. (Has many good points... art and ideas... but turn off for me )

- Song and Silence: Too splatty for me... dissapointed.


I buy usually only core books so most are WOTC stuff... but Relics and Rituals was so so... but wouldnt put it as a Bottom D&D thing. I rarely use it thou.

 

[Nightfall]

Ok, now I know I am strange. My worst three are:

Creature Colection (S&S). Riddled with problems related to its early release.

Which they will fix in a new book: Creature Collection Revised:

Rituals and Relics: Lots of over powered spells and very unappealing prestige classes . Just look at the summoner. +1 spell casting every level and a Metamagic feat every second level. Every second level a bonus spell casting slot of a summoning spell. WAY over the top.

Uhm I disagree, the Penumbral Lord has a lot going for it, the Sea Witch, the Blood Witch and the Crypt Lord. The Summoner might need a little fine tuning but it's no more overpowered than the Archmage. Believe me, THAT'S overpowered by far. As for the spells, I personally think the Paladin spells are very well done, and before Tome and Blood came out, so were the spells that improved Cha, Int and Wis. Plus the spells like Shadow Twin and Animate Shadow, they really are some great spells. Besides I can think of a few more over powered things than what goes down in R&R.