Brilliant Energy Weapons - Ignore Shields?

[Gort]

I'm considering converting a +4 longsword into a +1 brilliant energy longsword. (paying the 18 grand or so, naturally)

Reading the description, it ignores armour bonuses and enhancements to armour. Other bonuses, such as natural armour, deflection and so forth, are not ignored.

However, it doesn't mention shield bonuses. It would make sense, logically, that it would ignore them, but shield bonuses aren't mentioned at all in the description. Are they ignored?

 

[Gort]

Since this is a rules Q, I may as well post the rule.

Brilliant Energy
A brilliant energy weapon has its significant portion transformed into light, although this does not modify the item’s weight. It gives off light as a torch (20-foot radius). A brilliant energy weapon ignores nonliving matter. Armor and enhancement AC bonuses do not count against it. (Dexterity, deflection, dodge, natural armor, and other such bonuses still apply.) A brilliant energy weapon cannot harm undead, constructs, and objects. Bows, crossbows, and slings cannot be enchanted with this ability.
Caster Level: 16th; Prerequisites: Craft Magic Arms and Armor, gaseous form, continual flame; Market Price: +4 bonus.

 

[Bauglir]

Based on the description I would say it bypasses shield AC, and put the lack of a specific mention down to something they forgot to update from 3.0 (where shields provided an armor bonus to AC)

That said, I would consider the Mage Armor, and Shield spells effective vs a Brilliant Energy weapon, since these spells create force effects, rather than material armour.

 

[Camarath]

Since this is a rules Q, I may as well post the rule.

I believe you posted the 3.0 ability. In 3.0 the shields granted an armor bonus (that stacked with the armor bonus from armor) rather than shield bonuses as in 3.5.

The 3.5 ability as stated in the SRD is thus.

"Brilliant Energy: A brilliant energy weapon has its significant portion transformed into light, although this does not modify the item’s weight. It always gives off light as a torch (20-foot radius). A brilliant energy weapon ignores nonliving matter. Armor and shield bonuses to AC (including any enhancement bonuses to that armor) do not count against it because the weapon passes through armor. (Dexterity, deflection, dodge, natural armor, and other such bonuses still apply.) A brilliant energy weapon cannot harm undead, constructs, and objects. This property can only be applied to melee weapons, thrown weapons, and ammunition.
Strong transmutation; CL 16th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, gaseous form, continual flame; Price +4 bonus."

 

[Halivar]

That said, I would consider the Mage Armor, and Shield spells effective vs a Brilliant Energy weapon, since these spells create force effects, rather than material armour.

I wouldn't count mage armor, since it adds a bonus that does not stack with an armor enhancement bonus, implying that they are somehow similar. I would aslo argue that bracers of armor also do not stop a brilliant energy weapon for the same reason.

PS: I don't necessarity like armor enhancement bonuses being ignored by brilliant energy, but I'll trust the playtesters.

 

[Pyrex]

PS: I don't necessarity like armor enhancement bonuses being ignored by brilliant energy, but I'll trust the playtesters.

BE is bad enough already, why make it worse by not allowing it to bypass the enhancement bonus?

 

[dcollins]

I'm considering converting a +4 longsword into a +1 brilliant energy longsword. (paying the 18 grand or so, naturally)

A few pointers:
- By the rules, you can't do this. You can add abilities but not take them away (like the +4 bonus). You'd need to sell the former (half price, get ~16,000) and buy the latter outright (full price, ~50,000). Total outlay: 34,000 gp.

- Force protections don't give any defense to brilliant energy. Whenever force effects give special defense, they are so mentioned (like in the DMG Incorporeality description).

- I agree that brilliant energy ignores shields in either edition.

 

[Bauglir]

I wouldn't count mage armor, since it adds a bonus that does not stack with an armor enhancement bonus, implying that they are somehow similar. I would aslo argue that bracers of armor also do not stop a brilliant energy weapon for the same reason.

Fair enough - I got the impression that it should deflect brilliant energy weapons from the idea that as a force effect, it repels incorporeal touch attacks, and the two are similar (although not identical) in nature.

If it ever came up, would you allow someone to swing a brilliant energy weapon through a Wall of Force?

 

[MerakSpielman]

A few pointers:
- By the rules, you can't do this. You can add abilities but not take them away (like the +4 bonus). You'd need to sell the former (half price, get ~16,000) and buy the latter outright (full price, ~50,000). Total outlay: 34,000 gp.

I'd allow it, for the same price as adding Brillient Energy to a regular +1 Longsword. I can't see that it would be a major problem.

 

[dcollins]

Like I said, the rules don't allow it. See DMG: "Adding New Abilities". House rules are of course judgement calls.