Oofta
Legend
Ever tried to burn a piece of finished wood that's
*EDIT: I did not mistakenly type horizontal when I meant vertical. I was just checking to see if anybody read the post. Yeah, that's it.
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D&D 5E Burning doors with firebolt
Ever tried to burn a piece of finished wood that's
*EDIT: I did not mistakenly type horizontal when I meant vertical. I was just checking to see if anybody read the post. Yeah, that's it.
Andor
First Post
RAW can a fire bolt take down a door. Sure, although as noted the DM sets the stats for the door.
Game balance wise is it a problem? Nope. The ability to open a door is unremarkable.
Realism wise is it a problem? No, not really. A Firebolt can kill a healthy man in a few seconds. It takes a serious amount of fire to kill someone quickly. Thinking about it that way a firebolt spell is probably more akin to a weak SF plasma gun than a zippo lighter. (It does the same damage as a flintlock pistol. Would you rather have someone throw a lit zippo at you or shoot you with a blackpower pistol?) That said I expect killing a 1st level character with one is more along the lines of "He got burnt and dropped dead of shock." than it is "A pair of blinking eyes in a pile of ash." So yeah, rambling aside I have no problem with using a firebolt cantrip to burn down a door, but it wouldn't be quick, or clean, or quiet so I'm not sure why you would.
Game balance wise is it a problem? Nope. The ability to open a door is unremarkable.
Realism wise is it a problem? No, not really. A Firebolt can kill a healthy man in a few seconds. It takes a serious amount of fire to kill someone quickly. Thinking about it that way a firebolt spell is probably more akin to a weak SF plasma gun than a zippo lighter. (It does the same damage as a flintlock pistol. Would you rather have someone throw a lit zippo at you or shoot you with a blackpower pistol?) That said I expect killing a 1st level character with one is more along the lines of "He got burnt and dropped dead of shock." than it is "A pair of blinking eyes in a pile of ash." So yeah, rambling aside I have no problem with using a firebolt cantrip to burn down a door, but it wouldn't be quick, or clean, or quiet so I'm not sure why you would.
Andor
First Post
If the door is horizontal, the Barbarian probably already opened it.
Oofta
Legend
An arrow would kill a commoner, but would only nick the door. Heck, a rifle bullet may or may not even put a hole in it.
But it's a game, so do what makes sense to you. I just always assumed that doors were made out of something tougher than marshmallows.
Okay, we've covered downsides of fire, from spell or oil or otherwise.
How about Eldritch Blast as a door-opening method?
I'd say no problem. There are LOTS of excellent fantasy stories in whicj the problem of opening doors is not a significant element. Beowulf vs. the Door, Merlin vs. the Door... it's a D&D trope but not a *necessary* trope.
How about Eldritch Blast as a door-opening method?
I'd say no problem. There are LOTS of excellent fantasy stories in whicj the problem of opening doors is not a significant element. Beowulf vs. the Door, Merlin vs. the Door... it's a D&D trope but not a *necessary* trope.
Henry
Autoexreginated
Because Eldritch blast is Force damage, oddly enough I'd have less problem with the door getting blasted. However, it's still going to take multiple attempts, and be pretty loud and noisy -- all of which a Rogue and their lockpicks could have bypassed with a lot more surprise.
Greenfield
Adventurer
First, presume that the players aren't the first people in the world to ever think of obvious uses/abuses of magic. They aren't dealing with a bunch of mundanes who've no idea if/how/that Magic works.
That's a good thought to keep in mind, not just in this situation but whenever when players try to get too creative.
Next I'd like to observe the difference between real world operations and game mechanics: In the real world that very solid door would be made of solid timbers, probably oak, and that don't light easily. Further, if they're in a damp setting (such as any underground area) they'll flicker out fairly quickly. Think of the Firebolt as being roughly the equivalent of a cigarette lighter.
Lighting a campfire usually requires tinder and kindling, small,. easily lit pieces of dry material. Even with a lighter you don't jus light a log on fire.
That's the real world. Can you envision trying to light that door, and burn it down, using a lighter? Can you see that image?
Good. Now wipe it from your memory, because that has nothing to do with game mechanics.
Game rules don't ever deal with smoke from burning doors, or the fact that these will consume the oxygen in a tight, underground space. Nobody worries about carbon-monoxide poisoning, and wood is flameble, whether it's a handful of matchwood or an ancient and damp timber from the hold of a ship. The rules make no distinction.
So, by the book, the trick works.
Now, what could keep it from working?
Presume that the timbers are soaked in creasote or some similar preservative. Also figure that the people who built them, as part of a defense, were aware of that cantrip, among other things.
Now actual creasote comes from a plant found in the "New World". Like corn, potatoes and tobacco (i.e. "pipe weed"), none of these existed in pre-Columbian Europe, the world so many of our games are modeled after. So don't worry about how creasote actually burns, that isn't what the doors were treated with.
So what was that door treated with? Something fire retardant? Something that puts off a truly noxious smoke when burned? As in, Poison saves for breathing in the vapors? Big hazard in case of a real fire, but stone buildings just don't burn all that easily or often, and it's not like there were actual fire codes to contend with.
So booby trap the doors.
Think along those lines. Also, think about traps designed to go off specifically when the doors are burned. Some small Alchemical thing that will burst when heated, spattering flaming liquid at everything within five feet. An ampule or three embedded right into the wood would be simple and relatively inexpensive.
That's a good thought to keep in mind, not just in this situation but whenever when players try to get too creative.
Next I'd like to observe the difference between real world operations and game mechanics: In the real world that very solid door would be made of solid timbers, probably oak, and that don't light easily. Further, if they're in a damp setting (such as any underground area) they'll flicker out fairly quickly. Think of the Firebolt as being roughly the equivalent of a cigarette lighter.
Lighting a campfire usually requires tinder and kindling, small,. easily lit pieces of dry material. Even with a lighter you don't jus light a log on fire.
That's the real world. Can you envision trying to light that door, and burn it down, using a lighter? Can you see that image?
Good. Now wipe it from your memory, because that has nothing to do with game mechanics.
Game rules don't ever deal with smoke from burning doors, or the fact that these will consume the oxygen in a tight, underground space. Nobody worries about carbon-monoxide poisoning, and wood is flameble, whether it's a handful of matchwood or an ancient and damp timber from the hold of a ship. The rules make no distinction.
So, by the book, the trick works.
Now, what could keep it from working?
Presume that the timbers are soaked in creasote or some similar preservative. Also figure that the people who built them, as part of a defense, were aware of that cantrip, among other things.
Now actual creasote comes from a plant found in the "New World". Like corn, potatoes and tobacco (i.e. "pipe weed"), none of these existed in pre-Columbian Europe, the world so many of our games are modeled after. So don't worry about how creasote actually burns, that isn't what the doors were treated with.
So what was that door treated with? Something fire retardant? Something that puts off a truly noxious smoke when burned? As in, Poison saves for breathing in the vapors? Big hazard in case of a real fire, but stone buildings just don't burn all that easily or often, and it's not like there were actual fire codes to contend with.
So booby trap the doors.
Think along those lines. Also, think about traps designed to go off specifically when the doors are burned. Some small Alchemical thing that will burst when heated, spattering flaming liquid at everything within five feet. An ampule or three embedded right into the wood would be simple and relatively inexpensive.
Yes, force attacks are more akin to hitting it with an axe, I can see it being broken open with say 50 damage, or 25 if the lock is targetted. Definitely vastly more practical than trying to burn it down.
There are no hard rules for firebolts burning down doors in 5e so I don't know where you get this from.
