But what if I LIKE Anime/Video-game tropes in my D&D?

[~Johnny~]

I'm baffled by people who think 4e is hugely influenced by anime and video games. What is that based on? Because dragonborn and tieflings look like they would be at home in a game like World of Warcraft? Well geez, dragon-men have been walking around in mainstream fantasy since Dragonlance, and tieflings have been around for 13 years.

I don't see anime influence in 4e, but I wholeheartedly agree that D&D should incorporate what's fun and popular in fantasy today, not keep rehashing Howard and Lieber.

 

[Wolfspider]

So, enlighten me. What deeper meaning does REH show in those stories? What deep-seeded concepts are buried in the simple bloodthirsty action of Phoenix on the Sword? Or the lust-addled chase of The Frost Giant's Daughter? Or the Queen of the Black Coast?

I love Howard's work, but these stories were written to help sell magazines to young men that liked action and sex. It's like Michael Bay versus Ridley Scott. Michael Bay makes entertaining movies that can tug your heartstrings, but they usually don't have the depth that David Lynch brings. I like guilty entertainment like pulp stories and Michael Bay movies just as much as I like more "intellectual" entertainment like high-concept works (Tolkein) and David Lynch movies.

Shakespeare wrote his plays to make a buck, never expecting that they would have any lasting worth at all. Charles Dickens wrote his novels in episodic form so that he could capitalize on cliff-hangers and drive his huge audience wild. R.E. Howard was also a popular author of his time. The reasons why these authors wrote what they did or how they were published or for what audience are completely irrelevent to their significance.

In any case, Howard's stories explore themes of existentialism and primitivism and have some interesting things to say about the nature of so-called civilization. In fact, just recently there has been a revival of Howard criticism. I guess these critics and editors are just wasting their time, though.

I'm sorry that you only saw titilation in his works. There is a lot more.

 

[Rechan]

I'm baffled by people who think 4e is hugely influenced by anime and video games. What is that based on? Because dragonborn and tieflings look like they would be at home in a game like World of Warcraft? Well geez, dragon-men have been walking around in mainstream fantasy since Dragonlance, and tieflings have been around for 13 years.

It's more the mechanics, I think.

Wizards are just evokers = just like WoW.

Fighters got powarz. That's Anime, AND video-gamey.

Per encounters = refresh abilities and button mashing.

Monsters have a narrower focus with their abilities = just faceles monsters with one trick for killing.

 

[The Ubbergeek]

Bahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Fantasy ayatholas, ugh...

 

[Benben]

Somebody in the Middle

I am somewhere in the middle. I am a child of the 90s. I first started playing D&D in the 4th grade, which I think was somewhere around 1986-87 with a family that was family of 5 boys who all played D&D. That was a blast. But at that same time they introduced me to Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Robotech (both the game and the cartoon). The cartoon especially fascinated me because I had never before encountered something so complex. But my 7th grade the family had moved away and I found new friends who were into Cyberpunk 2020 and Shadowrun.

By the time I hit high school I found Vampire the Masquerade. For the record I never wore a trench coat, and I didn't start listening to dark music till I hit college (1994). But this game and it's follow-ons were what I was looking for: politics, carnage, and philosophy (especially in Mage).

So when I saw 3rd edition I was very happy to see a decent system being applied to D&D. I had been hooked on the Storyteller system (despite its numerous, numerous flaws) and the number crunching of Cyperpunk 2020. But as time wore on and I played the heck out of 3rd ed the flaws continued to grate on me. And they continue to do so, and as such I'm very excited to see what Mearls & co do to D&D.

I'm not at all worried about anime tropes or changes to the default flavor. I've been home brewing settings for decades. What I want is a game system that is fun to play for people who haven't studied the rule book for years and years. That is my biggest problem with D&D 3.X edition. It's prone to more optimization and min maxing than any edition of Gurps or Vampire 2nd ed. Worse yet, I have had a terrible time teaching the system to others, its just to complex and full of too much minutia for casual gamers.

And for the record: I admire Tolkien world building and linguistic skills, but could never stand his approach to narrative. From the 70s I am in total love with the Amber Chronicles by Zelazny. But my bread and butter fantasy is David Eddings Belgariad. It's not for the complex narrative or deeper meanings, but for the interactions between characters that has always felt to me what the ideal D&D table should be: a true team, but full of constant humorous bickering.

 

[Mistwell]

Anime / Movies / Videogames is where people get their fantasy today. Not books. Books readers are few and far between. If you are marketing a RPG to the mass audience, why would you not focus it on what people want?

Movies? Sure, some. Videogames, yes. But anime? Sorry, no.

Though you will find a lot of vocal anime fans around here, anime as a genre in the US is extremely small. It's ratings on cable are so minuscule that they barely register, and the entire slate has been close to cancellation before. DVD rentals of anime are also so small that most major distributors don't even like to carry it. And while it's picked up in comic books, it's still not a favored genre with fans. In short...anime is a small niche. Far smaller in fact that fantasy books. Harry Potter, Eragon, Narnia, Artemis Fowl, etc...all sell far better than anime in almost any form.

 

[Incenjucar]

I do hope everyone here is at least aware the difference between shonen and anime as a whole.

Seeing as how 99% of what's on TV is shonen, which is the Japanese equivalent of Thundercats.

 

[The Grackle]

In short, anyone HAPPY about the move to add some anime and videogame elements into the old horse that is D&D?

Sure. I am.

I started playing AD&D around 1985 when i was 8 yrs old. It was the first fantasy anything I encountered, and from there I read all the novels Gary recommended in the DMG. (Alot of which, I would pass on today, though Leiber's still my all-time-favorite.)

Later on, I played alot of video games, American and Japanese. I remember playing Final Fantasy for the first time and thinking, "Oh this is just D&D except the wizard wears an Orko hat." Really, most stuff from CRPGs is based primarily on D&D: HP, AC, levels, spells, attributes, magic items, and especially the endless dicking around with stuff in your inventory.

So I don't think D&D can steal from videogames, it's just re-absorbing some of the material that it spawned.

Oddly enough, it wasn't until I played Final Fantasy Tactics that I really understood D&D. When I was a kid, we never used minis; we just described everything. But after FF Tactics I realized the joy and beauty of the battle-grid.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

In short, anyone HAPPY about the move to add some anime and videogame elements into the old horse that is D&D?

Some?

Yes.

But by and large, I'd prefer such elements to be in a seperate RPG that is on point, like BESM or perhaps Exalted...

D&D is the quintessential high-fantasy RPG with a western, legendary bent. That is part of its charm & flavor, part of what has let it survive 30 years.

Per encounter powers are a good idea, but they shouldn't be the overwhelming majority of powers- per-day has my vote. Ditto my dislike of the shift away from Vancian magic. Those are elements that make players manage their resources in non-videogamey ways.

 

[TwinBahamut]

D&D is the quintessential high-fantasy RPG with a western, legendary bent. That is part of its charm & flavor, part of what has let it survive 30 years.

Per encounter powers are a good idea, but they shouldn't be the overwhelming majority of powers- per-day has my vote. Ditto my dislike of the shift away from Vancian magic. Those are elements that make players manage their resources in non-videogamey ways.

Well, the Suikoden series of videogame RPGs feature a system in which magic is based on spell levels which each have a number of uses per day. The original Final Fantasy also has a Vancian system.

I really don't see how Vancian magic is "non-videogamey" if it is a system that works just as well in videogames as in an RPG, with the exact same advantages and pitfalls.