Can I wear a symbol of death on my armor?

[Alzrius]

A player in a friend's campaign wants to wear a symbol of death on his armor as an offensive tactic.

Is there any language on whether or not this is allowed? I know that the spell description is largely silent on it, but I seem to recall this being covered in Sage Advice in an issue of Dragon, though I seem to locate it. It's not covered in the FAQ either. Does anyone know of any rulings from WotC regarding this sort of scenario?

 

[Nifft]

Unless he and the rest of the party are blind, this is probably a really bad idea.

Cheers, -- N

 

[olshanski]

I was under the impression that a symbol was triggered when anyone looked at it, and it then targeted whoever was nearest to the symbol (which might not be the person looking at it).

So anytime an opponent looked at the character's armor, the character would be the first person targeted by the symbol.

This spell allows you to scribe a potent rune of power upon a surface. When triggered, a symbol of death slays one or more creatures within 60 feet of the symbol (treat as a burst) whose combined total current hit points do not exceed 150. The symbol of death affects the closest creatures first, skipping creatures with too many hit points to affect. Once triggered, the symbol becomes active and glows, lasting for 10 minutes per caster level or until it has affected 150 hit points’ worth of creatures, whichever comes first. Any creature that enters the area while the symbol of death is active is subject to its effect, whether or not that creature was in the area when it was triggered. A creature need save against the symbol only once as long as it remains within the area, though if it leaves the area and returns while the symbol is still active, it must save again.
Until it is triggered, the symbol of death is inactive (though visible and legible at a distance of 60 feet). To be effective, a symbol of death must always be placed in plain sight and in a prominent location. Covering or hiding the rune renders the symbol of death ineffective, unless a creature removes the covering, in which case the symbol of death works normally.
As a default, a symbol of death is triggered whenever a creature does one or more of the following, as you select: looks at the rune; reads the rune; touches the rune; passes over the rune; or passes through a portal bearing the rune.

 

[Alzrius]

My friend didn't specify, but I'm taking it for granted that the character casting the symbol is using the attunement option for the entire party.

You also can attune any number of creatures to the symbol of death, but doing this can extend the casting time. Attuning one or two creatures takes negligible time, and attuning a small group (as many as ten creatures) extends the casting time to 1 hour. Attuning a large group (as many as twenty-five creatures) takes 24 hours. Attuning larger groups takes proportionately longer. Any creature attuned to a symbol of death cannot trigger it and is immune to its effects, even if within its radius when triggered. You are automatically considered attuned to your own symbols of death, and thus always ignore the effects and cannot inadvertently trigger them.

The question here isn't so much about the viability of this as a combat tactic (though having to spend an hour casting the spell does help prevent abuse), but about whether or not such a tactic can be done at all. Specifically, he thought (and I seem to remember also) that there was a Sage Advice column addressing whether or not a symbol of any sort could be put on armor/a shield and then actively brought into an enemy's sight.

 

[Nifft]

Since there's a Tome of Magic Devil with a permanent symbol of pain on its tongue, who does pretty much exactly what your group wants to do, I'd say the rules do support it.

They should be wary of summoned monsters, innocent bystanders, etc. I still think it's probably a really bad idea.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Jack Simth]

A player in a friend's campaign wants to wear a symbol of death on his armor as an offensive tactic.

Is there any language on whether or not this is allowed? I know that the spell description is largely silent on it, but I seem to recall this being covered in Sage Advice in an issue of Dragon, though I seem to locate it. It's not covered in the FAQ either. Does anyone know of any rulings from WotC regarding this sort of scenario?

The spell description explicitly says "You can’t use a symbol of death offensively" and gives one example (a sword, set to go off when it strikes someone).

All other Symbol spells inherit the mechanics from it.

However, you can set up any triggering condition you like - "when something attacks me in a manner that would end the Sor/Wiz 2 invisibility spell" is a technically defensive use that'll come up a lot when you're playing offense. Just don't get attacked in town... you'll be a mass-murderer.

You're generally better off with Symbol of Persuasion, though - at level 15 when you can make a Symbol of Death, half the critters will be outright immune due to HP totals, and many critters have a very nice Fort save. Symbol of Persuasion will end fights completely, has no HP limit, doesn't make you a mass-murderer if it accidentally goes off in a town, and is more accessible (as it is a lower-level spell), and it's cheaper to Permenency. Down side: More stuff is immune, lower save (although you can Heighten it, if your party Wizard or Cleric has that feat, to get rid of that issue).

 

[moritheil]

The spell description explicitly says "You can’t use a symbol of death offensively" and gives one example (a sword, set to go off when it strikes someone).

All other Symbol spells inherit the mechanics from it.

I interpret that to mean that you can't force someone to trigger it - but if they perform the triggering action on their own, they're out of luck.

And when I do this sort of thing, I also use a symbol of persuasion. Less mess when you accidentally trigger it.

 

[Sigdel]

Tell him that he can dress however he wants and his mother still loves him, despite all the people he hurts.

Lets hear it for motherly love.

 

[moritheil]

Unless he and the rest of the party are blind, this is probably a really bad idea.

Cheers, -- N

Incidentally, if your party is undead (and presumably evil enough to not care about bystanders) it becomes less objectionable.

 

[Jack Simth]

I interpret that to mean that you can't force someone to trigger it - but if they perform the triggering action on their own, they're out of luck.

And when I do this sort of thing, I also use a symbol of persuasion. Less mess when you accidentally trigger it.

That is one choice of interpretation, yes.

Another is that, if it's already active, moving it so that its area includes an opponent means that the opponent is immune as long as the opponent remains in the area (similar to Antilife Shell).

Another is that any action that would trigger it doesn't when it's someone else defending themselves, and their intent is not so much to attack you as it is to keep you from hurting them.

It's the interpretation of the DM in question that matters, not a bunch of random people on the internet, I'm afraid.

Best bet for activation methods is generally for when someone attacks you, chaining to the invisibility definition for inclusiveness and simplicity. Then Permanencying it so that it doesn't run out.

Of course, as you can select any activation method, it's possible to create continuous fields. You need at least two, more is better. Both need permanency. Name them for simplicity. Symbol A's trigger is "when Symbol B is not active after Symbol B has been cast". Symbol B's trigger is "when A is not active". Alternately, you can just have them both activated "Always". They'll take 10 minute breaks every so often, of course, but as long as they've got the same caster level and you don't deliberately overlap the break timing, at least one will always be active (and you'll generally have two of them active). And the only reason to limit it to 2 is lack of available surface and the time to gather the XP to Permanency them. Put one on the Cleric's armor, another on the Cleric's shield, a third on the Rogue's armor, a fourth on the Fighter's armor ... and your DM will get very tired of rolling five Will saves for everyone that comes into range, and smite you.