Can you suggest a RPG system.

[MortonStromgal]

I understand your problem with the Savage Worlds dice mechanic. You're taking a simulationist view of it, and Savage Worlds has a different philosophy. Savage Worlds prefers speed and simplicity over simulation.

The die mechanic is designed so that you can quickly roll the die and see if you succeeded, usually without any math, and the exploding dice makes every roll potentially exciting.

As for your arm-wrestling example, any sensible GM would just say that the person with the higher strength die wins. There really is no element of chance in arm wrestling.

That said, you HAVE to play it to understand it. Even reading the book isn't enough because it's just that different.

Uhhh no, I have played it several times. Ubiquity is fast (at leased with custom dice). Having a fixed TN of 4 drives me batty! Why because the math applies to your roll! Ok I roll my d6 and get a 5 sweet oh wait no I'm at a - 3 penalty so uhh 5-3 is 2 thats not 4 so I miss. Like I said its the game I want to love but everytime I play it, the mechanics leave me cold.

 

[Rel]

I'll put in another vote for Savage Worlds filling a lot of your requirements listed in the OP.

I understand that what you've seen of it may leave you a bit cold. To be honest I never cared a think about the system until somebody who was good at running it ran it for me. I was instantly smitten and it has become one of my most favorite systems (I just started running a new fantasy game of it.).

As has been explained above by those more mathematically inclined than me, the dice system might look a bit wonky. But in practice it always feel like things average out just where you'd expect them to.

As for the characters seeming too much the same, that's not been my experience at all. By the time you get done factoring in Attributes, Skills, Edges and Hindrances (not to mention Powers and Trappings) there is a HUGE variety of character concepts. And, probably what I like most about character creation, is that you can, with the right combination of those things, emulate nearly any character you can imagine.

 

[ValhallaGH]

Having a fixed TN of 4 drives me batty! Why because the math applies to your roll!

So reverse all the math. Put it all on the TN instead of the roll.

Fast, simple, and it won't break anything.

I aim. This reduces the TN by 2. He's at Long Range, increasing the TN by 4. I'm wounded, upping the TN, but have a Trademark Weapon, lowering the TN, and I use the Double Tap technique, lowering it again. Net TN 5.

I agree, rolling well and still failing does suck. But that's always a danger when the system has penalties to throw around.

 

[nedjer]

Unusually I wasn't in the mood for game pimping yesterday, but I'm much recovered today. The usual open, free, player choicey, keep the simulation to a side order preferences apply. Traveller SRD, (well hidden away at Mongoose), Treasure and White Box D&D.

 

[MortonStromgal]

So reverse all the math. Put it all on the TN instead of the roll.

Yes, but I would have to create my own GM screen or I can just use another system. Currently I just use Ubiquity, I find its more fast, furious, fun than Savage Worlds. Mostly because I use the attack dice that come with Heroscape so I dont have to count odds/evens. You can just look down and see 5 skulls and 3 blanks. Theres 1001 great systems out there no reason to get tied to just one I would even include Savage Worlds in that 1001, but its just not for me (for more reasons than the direction of the math, I also don't like rolling damage and I want the defender to get to roll a dodge or parry).

 

[ValhallaGH]

We've all got our tastes. I'm just glad you know what yours are. :-D
(Though turning all the + into - and all the - into + is really, really easy. But I respect that you've got other issues.)

There are too many good systems, honestly. When I find one that does a lot of what I want, I latch onto it and don't let go until I have done what I want to. There are too many parts of life to spend all my time learning and playing new RPGs.
Sure, sometimes I miss out on good systems (if a GM of mine hadn't made me, I'd never have played the new SIFRP, and it satisfies pretty well), but that's one of the trades you make for doing the things you want to do.

 

[Rel]

We've all got our tastes. I'm just glad you know what yours are. :-D
(Though turning all the + into - and all the - into + is really, really easy. But I respect that you've got other issues.)

There are too many good systems, honestly. When I find one that does a lot of what I want, I latch onto it and don't let go until I have done what I want to. There are too many parts of life to spend all my time learning and playing new RPGs.
Sure, sometimes I miss out on good systems (if a GM of mine hadn't made me, I'd never have played the new SIFRP, and it satisfies pretty well), but that's one of the trades you make for doing the things you want to do.

This brings up a point that I think is worth mentioning to the OP:

A fantastic way to try on a lot of different game systems is to attend local or national conventions or even some of the Game Days organized through ENWorld.

I can't even count the number of systems (Savage Worlds among them) that excellent GMs have demoed for me at our NC Game Days and GenCon. In fact there are a few GMs in particular who seem to really shine best at showing off a system to others. Nearly every new system I've played in the last 8 years has been presented to me in this manner.

 

[KronikAlkoholik]

Not to get too far gone, since you don't seem to be wanting to continue it, but people often make a mistake when looking at acing dice-they think it is a gigantic boost to small dice, making a d4 the best die type.

It ain't.

Acing adds about .6 to the average result of any given die type. The actual increase in average roll is greater for smaller dice (~0.88 for d4, ~0.69 for d6, ~0.64 for d8, ~0.61 for d10, ~0.59 for d12), but the effect is that a d4 averages 3 and a d12 averages 7.
Example: TN 10.
A d4 aces twice and rolls a 2+. Total 10+. Odds ~5%.
A d12 rolls once and rolls a 10+. Odds 25%.
For Wild Cards (like the PCs) d4 has ~12% success (and ~4% critical failure), and d12 has ~31% success (and ~1% critical failure).

Bigger dice get better results, and roll fewer 1's (which can be significant when there are consequences for getting a 1 on the Trait die).
Factor in the dice-control option (bennies spent to reroll bad die results), and large dice are almost never overcome by small dice. And the exceptions are appropriately memorable.


Note that this it true for every game with exploding dice. The change in frequency only matters if you use a threshold-success system, like Shadowrun 4th or World of Darkness.

What I was referring to is that when the stronger D12 guy gets a exploding die he has already won so it doesn't increase his chance of winning. The D4 however getting a exploding die increases his chance of winning or draw.

 

[Sir Robilar]

The perfect system would be something generic so we could use it for any setting, would allow the characters be both cool and interesting and would require little prep time for me.

How about True20? It can do any setting, is easy to prep, based on 3.5 but not as complicated and needs no mat. Personally I disliked Savage Worlds but enjoyed True20 a lot. The Revised Rulebook + Warrior/Adepts/Expert´s Handbook is really all you need for countless hours of gaming.

 

[OnlineDM]

The only game I know well (so far) is D&D4e, and I thought I'd mention that for someone like you who seems to thrive on improv, you can improvise combats very easily with 4e, especially once you've run it for a little while. Flip open the book, look at a monster of an appropriate level, and re-skin the description to your heart's content. One level 4 brute is about the same as another as far as the numbers go. Heck, you could just use the sheet from the last rules update that lists monster damage, hit points and defenses by level and by role and not bother with a book at all!

In the end, though, if you don't want a game with a battlemap and tactical positioning, I agree that D&D4e is not for you.

I'm looking forward to getting my first taste of Savage Worlds in a couple of weeks at TactiCon here in the Denver area - I'm expecting that it will be a lot of fun!

 

[oni no won]

I second True20. It uses the d20 system so it will feel familiar if you played D&D3.x. It streamlined chargen and combat and uses a wound system. It is GM friendly (meaning easy to prep for) and can handle multiple genre.

Another rpg you may want to take a look at is FantasyCraft. While it is fantasy oriented, it is part of the MasterCraft family which is the underlying system that will be used in future settings across multiple genre (not to be confused for it being a generic system). This system is very GM friendly without having to sacrifice the cool factor for the players.

 

[Set]

Echoing recommendations for;

GURPS (I find 3rd edition best for me, but coming in cold, 4th edition will probably be better for a new person).

True 20.

Mutants & Masterminds 2e. (Various supplements suggest ways to make it work in fantasy, etc. but they are completely unecessary. You can do it all with the main book.)

HERO games is supposedly good too, but I've got almost no experience with it (a few games at GenCon and Origins, at most) and, IMO, GURPS 4e leans a little too much in it's direction, with every single power being customized from the ground up in painstakingly fidgety detail. GURPS 3e (or M&M 2e) are 'easier' for me, since they kinda spoon-feed me prebuilt powers that I can tweak to my tastes. I'm too lazy for HERO or GURPS 4e.

.

The decker thing, IMO, crops up in psionics games where one character can astral project or dream travel, in fantasy games where one character is aquatic or can fly, in warwolf the porklips games where one can umbral travel, in superhero games where one can super-speed ahead of the group and get somewhere way before everyone else, or in pretty much any game where that broody loner with uber-stealth skills insists on 'scouting ahead' in Chateau Von Zarovich and gets ganked and comes back and tries to eat the party, etc, etc, etc.

Any game mechanic or special ability or cyber-environment that encourages (or even requires!) one player to be separated from the rest of the party and run his own little solo adventure ends up kinda sucking for the rest of the party, who end up standing around holding their cheese (and, in the cases of games with CR appropriate challenges, WILL get the solo dude killed, eventually, since the encounters are designed to put the hurt on him *and* all of his friends, not just him swimming / astral walking / flying / shadow jumping / speed-forcing, etc. off on his own).

 

[KronikAlkoholik]

This brings up a point that I think is worth mentioning to the OP:

A fantastic way to try on a lot of different game systems is to attend local or national conventions or even some of the Game Days organized through ENWorld.

I can't even count the number of systems (Savage Worlds among them) that excellent GMs have demoed for me at our NC Game Days and GenCon. In fact there are a few GMs in particular who seem to really shine best at showing off a system to others. Nearly every new system I've played in the last 8 years has been presented to me in this manner.

I live in Iceland so that's not gonna happen. Living in such a huge country obviously has it's upsides.

 

[Rel]

I live in Iceland so that's not gonna happen. Living in such a huge country obviously has it's upsides.

I missed that. Bummer.

Well you're on the right track asking around here. Lots of experienced gamers!

 

[Glyfair]

HERO games is supposedly good too, but I've got almost no experience with it (a few games at GenCon and Origins, at most) and, IMO, GURPS 4e leans a little too much in it's direction, with every single power being customized from the ground up in painstakingly fidgety detail. GURPS 3e (or M&M 2e) are 'easier' for me, since they kinda spoon-feed me prebuilt powers that I can tweak to my tastes. I'm too lazy for HERO or GURPS 4e.

I've been a long-time HERO veteran (although I haven't touched it since the mid-90s). HERO is not a system for someone concerned with "invest time making battlemaps and stats for every single enemy."

My initial recommendation would be Heroquest, which is very good for multiple genres. They haven't explored much in print, but I am considering using it for my next James Bond game. The big issue is that it is a very narrativist game and the OP considered Savage Worlds to be "too abstract." Heroquest is very abstract and flexible, which is why it is so good for so many genres.

In my experience most games that meet his needs for flexibility and simplicity do so by becoming more abstract. I expect there is a very narrow sweet spot for what he is looking for, but I am not sure what it is (mostly because I don't consider Savage Worlds that abstract.

 

[scourger]

Yep, Savage Worlds, for all the reasons mentioned upthread. When I first ran it, it reduced my prep time by about 90%.

The only other suggestion I have is to try a D&D minis skirmish campaign. It will give you what you seek as a DM. But, it doesn't really have the options and skills that the palyers want.

 

[Wightbred]

I'll put in another plug for Apocalypse World / Dungeon World. It meets many of your criteria, except as mentioned not bein generic. However, I've found it a very simple sustem with all of the rules on a couple of pages, and from this people are making a number of excellent free hacks that give more options under the same ruleset. Recent ones I've downloaded include Saga of the Icelanders (Beta) and Conan. Not everyones cup of tea, but worth a look through the Dungeon World rules to see if it yours.

 

[pjrake]

How about Dragon Age? It is rules-light, has an innovative stunt system, and easy to prep.

I went from Savage Worlds, to D&D Essentials, to Dragon Age. Still love SW but having fun with DA now.

-PJ

 

[KronikAlkoholik]

Ok I've summarised quickly over some games mentioned here and I'm thinking about taking a closer look at FATE. I like it's dice mechanic over that of SW and I'm curious about the idea of aspects.

Any reason SW is better then FATE ?

 

[Rel]

Ok I've summarised quickly over some games mentioned here and I'm thinking about taking a closer look at FATE. I like it's dice mechanic over that of SW and I'm curious about the idea of aspects.

Any reason SW is better then FATE ?

I've never played FATE but I've heard lots of good things about it.

My impression is that FATE is a bit more toward the fluff/roleplay end of the spectrum than Savage Worlds is but I may be off base there.