Can you teleport out of a glue trap?

[Infiniti2000]

The axe blade will have an effect, because you are trying to seperate your hand from your forearm, not your hand from the pillar.

Exactly. You can separate the hand from the wrist or the skin from the skin, but not the skin from the pillar (leaving the skin & pillar intact). You can break of part of the pillar, etc., but dim door intrisically does not carry with it the ability to "break apart" an object -- be it your hand or the pillar, nor can it remove the glue, so it would have to have no effect.

Okay, the adversary part I can understand. But you're looking for a romantic interest that they can't just hack down and forget about?

They can't hack her down, but they can leave her on a sinking ship? I'm with you 100% on the Cold part, but you left out the 'bizarre' part.

I figure it should be something like a round of grappling, and if she maintains a grab for a round, he's stuck to her (holding hands, hand in mid-goose, etc etc).

I'd have to say it should be a pin, not just a hold.

 

[DM_Matt]

Oh, say, the annoying NPC doesn't want to be left behind on a sinking ship/burning building/ice floe whatever, so she bats her big blue eyes at the paladin, while pulling a vial of glue out of her glove of storing, coats her bare hand and.... lays on hands! I figure it should be something like a round of grappling, and if she maintains a grab for a round, he's stuck to her (holding hands, hand in mid-goose, etc etc). I doubt seriously the paladin would hack off her hand to get away, and the party wizard can't just Dim Door/Teleport him away and leave her behind, thus forcing the party to rescue the annoying NPC until they can get some Universal Solvent. Basically, I'd like an advesary/romantic interest that they can't just hack down and forget about.

Are you implying that your group's paladin would actively refrain from saving someone's life because she is annoying? I'm a big advocate of cutting paladins slack on code enforcement, but thats a pretty clear-cut case of entirely unpaladinlike behavior. You shouldnt need him to be glued to her. He should lose his powers if he leaves her behind.

(BTW, for ideas about this kind of situation, check out the synopses of the frst few episodes of Stagate SG-1 Season 9. A character of that variety tricks one of the main characters into putting on a bracelet that turns out to bind them together in such a fashion that they die if they go too far apart. The device was invented for use by guards transporting prisoners alone.)

 

[Lord Pendragon]

What an unusual topic.

I think I'd rule that the paladin could teleport away, leaving the NPC and glue behind. Otherwise you could stop someone from teleporting, dimension dooring, or plane shifting with nothing more than a tanglefoot bag, and that sits wrong with me. A tanglefoot bag is a heck of a lot cheaper and more readily available than Dimensional Anchor. And where does it end? If the glue is effective, what about a small character and Evard's Black Tentacles? There's as much chance of that halfling breaking away from those tentacles as there is of the paladin getting away from the NPC without Universal Solvent. Does Evard's Black Tentacles block teleportation spells? What if a druid uses Stone Shape to have a boulder reach out and pull a sorcerer back against it, then shapes the stone around his torso? That sorcerer is stuck to that rock but good. Can he dimension door away?

No, none of that for me.

I'll instead rule that Conjuration (Teleportation) spells create a dimensional portal of exactly the dimensions of the spells' target(s), and when the spell completes--POP!--there's nothing there. The glue is glued to air molecules. Or perhaps there's an atomically fine layer of the teleported individual's skin still clinging to the glue (sheared off by the closing of the dimensional aperture). In any case, the spell goes off without a hitch, and the PC has left without incident.

Speaking of incident, incidentally, I as a player become extremely annoyed with DMs who railroad me into traveling with annoying characters. It isn't fun to be annoyed, and the only reasoning for it I can come up with is that such DMs are amused by my annoyance. Not the kind of DM I want to be playing under.

As a DM, I have introduced annoying characters in the past. Usually they are characters who are fun for me to role-play, but can quickly get on the players' nerves. But I never force them to travel with these individuals, and most of them are dropped like a bad habit.

 

[0-hr]

I agree with you Pendragon. I think that a big part of these spells is for getting out of sticky situations.

For those of you glueing mages to various things, would you let them Dimension Door out of a grapple? It seems like the same sort of situation, but with less adhesion (someone holding on vs glue or tanglefoot stickiness). Spells just seem to know the boundaries of the target. That's why they don't take a big chunk of floor with you when you port

Anyway, I don't think there is anything actually written on this so it's up to interpretation regardless...

 

[Len]

Otherwise you could stop someone from teleporting, dimension dooring, or plane shifting with nothing more than a tanglefoot bag, and that sits wrong with me.

I don't see how that would work. The argument for failing to teleport involved glue that cannot be broken and being stuck to an unwilling creature, neither of which apply for a tanglefoot bag. It's a different situation.

 

[Twowolves]

What an unusual topic.

I think I'd rule that the paladin could teleport away, leaving the NPC and glue behind. Otherwise you could stop someone from teleporting, dimension dooring, or plane shifting with nothing more than a tanglefoot bag, and that sits wrong with me. A tanglefoot bag is a heck of a lot cheaper and more readily available than Dimensional Anchor. And where does it end? If the glue is effective, what about a small character and Evard's Black Tentacles? There's as much chance of that halfling breaking away from those tentacles as there is of the paladin getting away from the NPC without Universal Solvent. Does Evard's Black Tentacles block teleportation spells? What if a druid uses Stone Shape to have a boulder reach out and pull a sorcerer back against it, then shapes the stone around his torso? That sorcerer is stuck to that rock but good. Can he dimension door away?


Speaking of incident, incidentally, I as a player become extremely annoyed with DMs who railroad me into traveling with annoying characters. It isn't fun to be annoyed, and the only reasoning for it I can come up with is that such DMs are amused by my annoyance. Not the kind of DM I want to be playing under.

As a DM, I have introduced annoying characters in the past. Usually they are characters who are fun for me to role-play, but can quickly get on the players' nerves. But I never force them to travel with these individuals, and most of them are dropped like a bad habit.

You are missing the point entirely. The reason for possibly not being to teleport out is not because you are stuck, but because you are stuck to an unwilling passenger. Someone capable of making a WIll save of any kind is NOT the same as being stuck to a rock. Apples and oranges.

Secondly, thanks for insinuating I'm a bad DM for introducing a very temporary annoyance to a PC. I guess you don't like pit traps or Charm spells or anything else that inconveniences a PC, and any DM that uses these things is automatically a bad one. Where, exactly, is it stated that I intended the PCs to be "forced" to travel with the NPC in question any further than to the local alchemist's shop to buy some Universal Solvent to unstick them? The entire point is that the NPC doesn't want to be left behind on a sinking ship, and the NPC doesn't know that the party won't just leave her. Getting out of the "dungeon" alive is her only priority, and going to jail later is ok. Inconvenient for all of maybe 30 minutes.

And no, I don't expect the Lawful Good characters in question to even consider for a moment hacking off the NPC's hand or anything like that. My players are not like that at all, and yes, there is a vial of Universal Solvent to be found in the adventure. I was merely positing the question, in the thought that it would be a minor, humorous annoyance that couldn't be immediately ignored by the wizard casting a Dimension Door and subsequently just slapping the NPC in manacles.

Just forget it. Being insulted for my attempt at a creative encounter by people who have no clue about my game or my players or my skill as a DM is just not worth my posting here. Nevermind.

 

[Lord Pendragon]

You are missing the point entirely. The reason for possibly not being to teleport out is not because you are stuck, but because you are stuck to an unwilling passenger. Someone capable of making a WIll save of any kind is NOT the same as being stuck to a rock. Apples and oranges.

Actually, it's apples and apples to me. If you stick the PC to a giant rock, he can't teleport because he'll exceed the weight limits. If you stick the PC to an unwilling passenger and rule the passenger must be included in the spell, then either the passenger exceeds the spell's limit (if there are then too many people) or makes his save, and prevents the spell from firing. In either case, you're using the fact that the 'porter is stuck to something to foil the spell. My ruling is meant to prevent this, because IMO there are too many simple was to get a 'porter stuck.

Also note that my primary example, a tanglefoot bag, is almost identical to your situation, because you are literally gluing the 'porter to the floor. If you can 'port out of a tanglefoot bag, why shouldn't you be able to port away from the NPC? In both cases you're ruling that the 'porter doesn't have to included the extra glued material, either the NPC--who could make his save or be one too many for the spell--or the floor, which is certainly outside the bounds of the spell's weight limit.

Secondly, thanks for insinuating I'm a bad DM for introducing a very temporary annoyance to a PC. I guess you don't like pit traps or Charm spells or anything else that inconveniences a PC, and any DM that uses these things is automatically a bad one. Where, exactly, is it stated that I intended the PCs to be "forced" to travel with the NPC in question any further than to the local alchemist's shop to buy some Universal Solvent to unstick them? The entire point is that the NPC doesn't want to be left behind on a sinking ship, and the NPC doesn't know that the party won't just leave her. Getting out of the "dungeon" alive is her only priority, and going to jail later is ok. Inconvenient for all of maybe 30 minutes.

It should be noted that suggesting that one might be using a poor tactic is not suggesting one is a bad DM. I offered my anecdote more as a warning, than as an admonishment. "Be careful, friend, there are a lot of players, like me, that would find this tactic unpleasant and it would take away from their fun." I even pointed out that I myself use it sparingly at times, so if I was calling you a poor DM for even mentioning it, I must be calling myself one as well.

If I worded it poorly I apologize. I merely meant to bring to your attention how your plans could play out other than how you envisioned them, for the players at least.

I was merely positing the question, in the thought that it would be a minor, humorous annoyance that couldn't be immediately ignored by the wizard casting a Dimension Door and subsequently just slapping the NPC in manacles.

This, again, was my point in my above post. What is humorous to you might not be so to your players. *shrug* This is a mistake I've made and later regretted, which is why I found it important to mention.

 

[Mylan]

Also note that my primary example, a tanglefoot bag, is almost identical to your situation, because you are literally gluing the 'porter to the floor.

Actually, as it has already been pointed out to you, there is a major difference between using a tanglefoot bag and sovereign glue. One is an alchemical item valued at 50 gp that lists several mundane ways of countering it, such as a DC 17 strength check, or dealing 15 points of damage to the goo with a slashing weapon. The other is a magical item valued at 2,400 gp that specifically states that once it is set, any attempts to seperate the bonded objects fail, unless universal solvent is applied first. If a mage is sovereign glued to a stone pillar, he cannot dimension door away because that would be an attempt to seperate the two bonded objects without applying universal solvent. If a mage is sovereign glued to another person who is unwilling to accept a dimension door, then the spell fails because either one person is unwilling, or because the mage can't go by himself, since that would be an attempt to seperate the two objects without applying universal solvent. The only thing stopping a mage from teleporting out of tanglefoot goo is a DC 15 concentration check.

 

[DM_Matt]

You are missing the point entirely. The reason for possibly not being to teleport out is not because you are stuck, but because you are stuck to an unwilling passenger. Someone capable of making a WIll save of any kind is NOT the same as being stuck to a rock. Apples and oranges.

Isnt your situation though really one where the passenger wants to come with and the caster doesnt want to bring them? If not, the does A) the clinger want to stay around and die? B ) The pally want to kill someone because she is annoying, or C ) She has some insane death pact thingee going on and would rather them both die than he leave her? If B ), the paladin should lose his powers if he doesnt bring her alone. If A or C, she is a danger to herself and/or others and the paladin would also probably be obligated to bring her along if possible, even if he has to knock her out first.

 

[Twowolves]

Isnt your situation though really one where the passenger wants to come with and the caster doesnt want to bring them? If not, the does A) the clinger want to stay around and die? B ) The pally want to kill someone because she is annoying, or C ) She has some insane death pact thingee going on and would rather them both die than he leave her? If B ), the paladin should lose his powers if he doesnt bring her alone. If A or C, she is a danger to herself and/or others and the paladin would also probably be obligated to bring her along if possible, even if he has to knock her out first.

Well, the idea is that he has to bring her along, attached if necessary, back to port. If the party wizard could just Dim Door the paladin away from the NPC, then they could leave her, or more likely, tie her up and bring her in as a prisoner. I fully expect the party will bring her back to port, get some Universal Solvent, separate them and have her arrested. I just didn't want the "twist" to be handwaved away with a spell. I think Mylan's response was along the lines I was thinking, and the justification I was looking for.

The NPC in question is one of those chaos/trickster/impulsive types, and this stunt was to illustrate that fact. An annoyance, not a threat, and potentially quite helpful. In short, someone they have to deal with instead of knocking out and handing over to the authorities.