Character Builds: Build me a combat rogue/sneak attack machine
- Thread starter Remathilis
- Start date
Inconsequenti-AL
Breaks Games
You are kinda limited as an elf. Any base class outside of 1 level of rouge levels will give you 20% XP penalty, except wizard - which isn't going to help a great deal with melee rogue-ishness...
I reckon the best bet might be a 16th level Rogue (7 Rogue/9 Assasin?) with charisma. If you're allowed leadership, select a 14th level cleric, druid or wizard - have them buff you seven ways from sunday. Ring of spell storing with transfomation, righteous might or divine power.
In lieu of the cohort, take a high level of UMD and buff yourself via scrolls, staffs and wands. Expensive, but could be effective.
And now for something completely different:
The Woodlands Killing machine.
I'd consider Rogue 8
ruid 8.
6 feats - Multiattack, Improved Multiattack, Natural Spell, dodge, mobility, spring attack.
You can transform into large creatures with up to 8 HD. Take on Tiger form, giving you a pounce attack and reasonable stats.
Arguably, you can pounce in, getting 6 attacks - 1 bite, 2 claws, 2 rakes, 1 extra attack from haste. That's a lot of hitting. I say arguably, because AFAIK whether you can charge (to get the pounce) and spring out is a somewhat muddy issue.
You can buff yourself with natural attack improving items and/or spells, 'wild' armour and so on. If you can, buy a #day item of animal growth - preferably one another party member can use on you - as you won't be able to use it on yourself while transformed and can't cast it yet, but it's mean! (if a little questionable as well).
A slight problem is that greater dispels at this level will tear right through your spells like they weren't there. Diverse talents from complete divine would really help, if only you had the feats to spare!
Figure it feels quite 'Elfish', IMO. And at Rogue 9/Druid 9 - you'll be a lot meaner.
To twink this a little further:
Rogue 5ruid 5: Assasin 3: Shapeshift enhancing PrC - 3.
I reckon the best bet might be a 16th level Rogue (7 Rogue/9 Assasin?) with charisma. If you're allowed leadership, select a 14th level cleric, druid or wizard - have them buff you seven ways from sunday. Ring of spell storing with transfomation, righteous might or divine power.
In lieu of the cohort, take a high level of UMD and buff yourself via scrolls, staffs and wands. Expensive, but could be effective.
And now for something completely different:
The Woodlands Killing machine.
I'd consider Rogue 8
ruid 8. 6 feats - Multiattack, Improved Multiattack, Natural Spell, dodge, mobility, spring attack.
You can transform into large creatures with up to 8 HD. Take on Tiger form, giving you a pounce attack and reasonable stats.
Arguably, you can pounce in, getting 6 attacks - 1 bite, 2 claws, 2 rakes, 1 extra attack from haste. That's a lot of hitting. I say arguably, because AFAIK whether you can charge (to get the pounce) and spring out is a somewhat muddy issue.
You can buff yourself with natural attack improving items and/or spells, 'wild' armour and so on. If you can, buy a #day item of animal growth - preferably one another party member can use on you - as you won't be able to use it on yourself while transformed and can't cast it yet, but it's mean! (if a little questionable as well).
A slight problem is that greater dispels at this level will tear right through your spells like they weren't there. Diverse talents from complete divine would really help, if only you had the feats to spare!
Figure it feels quite 'Elfish', IMO. And at Rogue 9/Druid 9 - you'll be a lot meaner.
To twink this a little further:
Rogue 5
ruid 5: Assasin 3: Shapeshift enhancing PrC - 3.
Last edited:
Thanee
First Post
A completely different option would be the Arcane Trickster (focussing on buff spells).
Rogue 3 / Wizard 5 / Arcane Trickster 8.
You'll have lower hit points and base attack and weaker armor, but you have a lot of great spells to make up for this loss (False Life, Greater Invisibility, Blink, Displacement, Stone Skin, Greater Magic Weapon, Polymorph, etc).
Feats: Improved Initiative, Quicken Spell, Practiced Spellcaster, and four more to increase your melee capabilities (i.e. TWF, Weapon Finesse, etc - or go for bow (hey, you are an elf) with Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot).
And keep a lesser metamagic rod of empower handy for those False Life spells.
Bye
Thanee
Rogue 3 / Wizard 5 / Arcane Trickster 8.
You'll have lower hit points and base attack and weaker armor, but you have a lot of great spells to make up for this loss (False Life, Greater Invisibility, Blink, Displacement, Stone Skin, Greater Magic Weapon, Polymorph, etc).
Feats: Improved Initiative, Quicken Spell, Practiced Spellcaster, and four more to increase your melee capabilities (i.e. TWF, Weapon Finesse, etc - or go for bow (hey, you are an elf) with Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot).
And keep a lesser metamagic rod of empower handy for those False Life spells.
Bye
Thanee
ruleslawyer
Registered User
Does it have to be a melee rogue?
I know that you have a character concept and all, but the fact is that elves are not well-suited for melee rogues for the simple reason that a -2 Con penalty and d6 hit die, in combination, do not make for a survivable combatant. Elves can make fine archer-rogues, but that's a different archetype.
That said, if you absolutely must, your key is to "min" the heck out of your multiclassing handicap by taking beaucoup PrCs, while maxing the heck out of BAB and SA. The basic build I'd suggest is:
Shadow-walker elf Rog3/Ftr2/shadow thief of Amn 5/Telflammar shadowlord 6
If you can use FR (which is required for the above PrCs anyway), take a wood elf for the +2 Str (although you lose out on Con, Int, AND Cha, who cares?).
This build isn't mine, BTW; the full build can be found at:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1836335#post1840967
In general, the following thread contains several rogue builds:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=132214<br />
I know that you have a character concept and all, but the fact is that elves are not well-suited for melee rogues for the simple reason that a -2 Con penalty and d6 hit die, in combination, do not make for a survivable combatant. Elves can make fine archer-rogues, but that's a different archetype.
That said, if you absolutely must, your key is to "min" the heck out of your multiclassing handicap by taking beaucoup PrCs, while maxing the heck out of BAB and SA. The basic build I'd suggest is:
Shadow-walker elf Rog3/Ftr2/shadow thief of Amn 5/Telflammar shadowlord 6
If you can use FR (which is required for the above PrCs anyway), take a wood elf for the +2 Str (although you lose out on Con, Int, AND Cha, who cares?).
This build isn't mine, BTW; the full build can be found at:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1836335#post1840967
In general, the following thread contains several rogue builds:
http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=132214<br />
orangefruitbat
Adventurer
May I suggest combining Invisible Blade with T. Shadowlord - bluff as a free action, wounding ability AND the ability to Shadow Pounce as a free action? IE, you can perform a full action sneak attack even when you don't start within 5' of your foe. Oh, the ability to avoid dying by making a reflex save is jextra gravy.
ruleslawyer said:
ruleslawyer
Registered User
Hmm; let's try it.
Elven Shadowblade
Wood elf shadow-walker Rog3/Ftr2/SToA5/TS4/Inv5
(PC acquires shadow-walker template around 6th or 7th level)
The nice thing about this build is that it gets you +16 BAB at character level 20 (ECL 21). The bad thing is that it doesn’t get you ITWF or GTWF.
So, here's one build, Remathilis! Your skills are practically pre-chosen for you, due to the PrC requirements. Max out Bluff, Hide, Move Silently, and maybe Tumble (though you don't really need it with Spring Attack and your shadowlord abilities), but otherwise you can do whatever you want.
Elven Shadowblade
Wood elf shadow-walker Rog3/Ftr2/SToA5/TS4/Inv5
(PC acquires shadow-walker template around 6th or 7th level)
Code:
Level Class BAB Saving Throws Feats Spells Class Abilities
1 Rogue (1) +0 +0/+2/+0 Dodge Sneak Attack +1d6, Trapfinding
2 Fighter (1) +1 +2/+2/+0 Weapon Finesse Fighter Feat
3 Fighter (2) +2 +3/+2/+0 Mobility, Persuasive Fighter Feat
4 Rogue (2) +3 +3/+3/+0 Evasion
5 Rogue (3) +4 +4/+3/+1 Sneak Attack +2d6, Trapsense +1
6 Shadow Thief (1) +4 +4/+5/+1 Spring Attack Doublespeak, Sneak Attack +3d6
7 Shadow Thief (2) +5 +4/+6/+1 Blind Fight Bonus Feat, Uncanny Dodge I
8 T. Shadowlord (1) +5 +4/+8/+1 0 Shadowsight, Shadowjump
9 T. Shadowlord (2) +6/+1 +4/+9/+1 Point Blank Shot 1 Shadowblur
10 T. Shadowlord (3) +7/+2 +5/+9/+2 1/0 Shadow Walk
11 T. Shadowlord (4) +8/+3 +5/+10/+2 2/1 Shadow Pounce
12 Shadow Thief (3) +9/+4 +6/+10/+3 Far Shot Sneak Attack +4d6, Reputation +1
13 Shadow Thief (4) +10/+5 +6/+11/+3 Weapon Focus (dagger) Bonus Feat, Reputation +2
14 Shadow Thief (5) +10/+5 +7/+12/+4 Sneak Attack +5d6, Uncanny Dodge II, Rep. +3
15 Invisible Blade (1) +11/+6/+1 +7/+14/+4 TWF Dagger SA +6d6, Unfettered defense
16 Invisible Blade (2) +12/+7/+2 +7/+15/+4 Bleeding wound
17 Invisible Blade (3) +13/+8/+3 +8/+15/+5 Dagger SA +7d6, uncanny feint (MEA)
18 Invisible Blade (4) +14/+9/+4 +8/+16/+5 Feint mastery
19 Invisible Blade (5) +15/+10/+5 +8/+16/+5 Dagger SA +8d6, uncanny feint (free action)So, here's one build, Remathilis! Your skills are practically pre-chosen for you, due to the PrC requirements. Max out Bluff, Hide, Move Silently, and maybe Tumble (though you don't really need it with Spring Attack and your shadowlord abilities), but otherwise you can do whatever you want.
Last edited:
Arc
First Post
Hey, this is a little bit of a tangent, but what's the legality status of Ghost Touch + Ring of Blinking. I've seen this combo tossed around a few times on the boards, and while a quick glance at the SRD seems like it might work, it's still a bit vague. Has there been a thread discussing this, or even better, a custserv or FAQ answer about it ?
sledged
First Post
As are the Telflammar Shadowlord PrC, the Shadow Thief of Amn PrC, the wood elf subrace, and the shodow-walker template. I can't see how they wouldn't be aware of the setting limitations of this build. I'm just imagining the character transversing half the continent to take levels in both PrCs. Foreign exchange thieves' guild member program?Thanee said:
Similar Threads
