Character development (a very long post)

[Plecak]

One more question guys.

What do you think about using Miracle (and possibly epic spells) to polymorph into a physically powerful creature (a giant or a titan)? Is is an acceptable tactics? I am a little bit worried about it since, using this tactics, spellcasters (especially clerics and druids) can become more powerful in melee combat than barbarians or fighters.

 

[Kat']

What do you think about using Miracle (and possibly epic spells) to polymorph into a physically powerful creature (a giant or a titan)? Is is an acceptable tactics?

Sure it is. Polymorph is a 4th level Wizard spell, it can be duplicated by Miracle. But beware, Polymorph is a can of worms and your DM's gonna hate you.

I am a little bit worried about it since, using this tactics, spellcasters (especially clerics and druids) can become more powerful in melee combat than barbarians or fighters.

Yes indeed, welcome to the world of high-level spellcasting! Yeah, you can turn into a Fire Giant, cast Quickened Righteous Might in the same round, Quickened Divine power in the second and still attack. That nets you, what, 39 Str, regardless of your magic items? Or turn into a Roper, grapple all your opponents at the same time and let the Rogue have fun! Or maybe a twelve-headed Hydra, a Black Pudding, or a Razor boar?

 

[eamon]

Yes indeed, welcome to the world of high-level spellcasting! Yeah, you can turn into a Fire Giant, cast Quickened Righteous Might in the same round, Quickened Divine power in the second and still attack. That nets you, what, 39 Str, regardless of your magic items? Or turn into a Roper, grapple all your opponents at the same time and let the Rogue have fun! Or maybe a twelve-headed Hydra, a Black Pudding, or a Razor boar?

Of course, if you expect perfect balance from epic level play, well... you might need to use a Miracle just to achieve that, for starters.

 

[moritheil]

Keep to straight casting. High level cleric spells will outweigh the short-term benefits of Fighter feats.

Feats for a Cleric are almost ancillary.

I don't exactly agree with this. It's true that a cleric taking fighter feats is generally making a mistake, but there is one feat that really makes a cleric shine in melee: Divine Metamagic (Persistent.)


Anyhow, do NOT leave that 10 in Con - put it in Dex or Int. As a front-line heavy bruiser, you don't really need tumble anyhow.

 

[Felix]

Divine Metamagic (Persistent.)

If this is in the game, please let the DM know that I have a wonderful bridge at a reasonable price for sale.

 

[Quartz]

In both cases I intend to use the Miracle spell to gain +5 inherent bonus to Wisdom.

You'll need to use the Wish spell, and you'll need 5 of them.

I agree with the other commenters. This is shaping up to be a really sub-optimal build. However, if you really do want spellcasting to be secondary, you might consider taking levels in Divine Crusader: not only do you get spellcasting but you get Weapon Specialisation at L5, which opens up Melee Weapon Mastery. Since you'll be DC5 at L14, you can take MWM the next level. Entry requirements are BAB +7 and Weapon Focus. The class is Cha-based, so you should take a couple of levels in Paladin first for the Cha-based save improvement. Stat bumps go in Cha of course.

One thing you absolutely must do if you want to mainly be a combatant is boost your Con. Talk your DM into letting you swap Int and Con at the very least.

At 20th level you'd be something like Cl 7 / P2 / DC 10 / Ftr 1

Cha will be 29 - 14 + 4 stat bumps +5 Inherent +6 Enhancement (Belt of Magnificence)

BAB will be +15 and assuming a +5 Inherent and +6 Enhancement bonus to Str and a +5 Weapon you will attack at +32 for +18 damage.

You should take the Power Attack feat.

 

[moritheil]

If this is in the game, please let the DM know that I have a wonderful bridge at a reasonable price for sale.

While DMM is infamous, I have seen several campaigns in which it was relatively balanced. I wouldn't automatically assume everything balance-related is ruined simply by the inclusion of this feat.

(Amongst other things, it makes NPC spellthieves very happy . . . )

 

[Felix]

I wouldn't automatically assume everything balance-related is ruined simply by the inclusion of this feat.

They may not always break the game, but there is the risk, and I don't see that they really add anything much: little benefit for a potentially horrifying risk.

 

[moritheil]

They may not always break the game, but there is the risk, and I don't see that they really add anything much: little benefit for a potentially horrifying risk.

This might be a simple matter of perspective: for me Pun-Pun or any other infinite loop is something that cannot be allowed, but I see nothing horrifying in a PC that devotes all his or her resources to being superior in melee combat. Finite numbers, however arbitrarily large, are not daunting. And the people I play with take a certain joy in being granted the freedom to make their characters as powerful as the rules will allow.

Of course, campaigns are different.

 

[Herobizkit]

Here's my philosophy on buffs:

"If you're casting, you're not swinging."

Buffs are excellent for the pre-game show, but if you're in the thick of it, AND you're in melee, you're usually too busy to think about casting spells. YMMV.

Fighters fight. Clerics heal and buff the Fighters. If the Cleric is a Fighter, he cannot both buff and fight unless he gets Quickened spells.