Characters defined by "their stuff"

[Mordane76]

As someone else suggested, instead of staying inside D&D proper, I branched out into other d20 products. I didn't go to Spycraft, but I went to d20 Modern and d20 Star Wars, using some slightly modified rules for magic users, by making alterations to the Mage and Mystic AdC. All this is about to start seeing play-test as well.

IMO, D&D really does rely too heavily on magical items, and the assumption that powerful magical items will be (more or less) readily available to characters as they level. I believe this idea so permeates this edition -- my regular players (to whom I apologize if they're reading this, but we have discussed my feelings on this OOG) sometimes seem more interested in what tangibles they can build/kill for/buy than in the story itself, because tangibles equal cool powers.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

The high-item "falvor" of DnD is seriously driving me to D20 Modern.

I'm currently running a high-level campaign (first one that wasn't a one-shot) and I hate doing treasure. In part I'm going to reward players (eg you ally with these guys, you get good stuff). This keeps the players from killing everything they see, and at the same time I don't have to explain why every Underdark kraken has a massive cache of treasure.

 

[Henry]

Examples of characters at least partially defined by "Their Stuff:"

King Arthur
Gollum
Raistlin Majere
Vecna
The prophet Elisha
the god Thor

In D&D, it's okay to have a signature item or two, something that can easily be identified with you and what you are. It's a staple of fantasy and fiction, as well as in some history as well (Faberge Eggs, or the Crown Jewels, anyone?) and should not be totally looked down upon, IMO.

3E better than any other version of D&D has gone out of its way to let the characters define the items, rather than vice versa.

 

[diaglo]

Vecna

how is Vecna a product of his stuff?

don't you mean his stuff is a product of him?

maybe you mean KAS....his lt. and his Sword.

 

[Henry]

how is Vecna a product of his stuff?

What's the FIRST thing that most gamers think of, when they hear the name "Vecna?"

Eye and Hand. Minus 10 points to anyone who fibs. The character of Vecna is synonymous with his eye and hand, the parts of himself that WotC has him trying to reclaim all over the place (and succeeds in the Vecna Lives! module). The story and legend of Vecna and his eye and hand are as synonymous as the hook and man are out of that "hook-handed killer" urban legend. Therefore, he and his story are defined by that eye and hand.

maybe you mean KAS....his lt. and his Sword.

...And you just provided me with another, less widely-known analogy.

 

[diaglo]

What's the FIRST thing that most gamers think of, when they hear the name "Vecna?"

you see i know the story tho.

there is a reason why he wants his eye and hand back.

and there is a reason why he lost them to begin with.

to me....Vecna started as a whole being. it wasn't until Kas did what he did...

just like Arthur is more than Excalibur...i would say his scabbard was more important if you asked me. or the Grail he has everyone seek. "I am the Land."

 

[Plane Sailing]

The prophet Elisha

I can't see how he could have been even partially described this way - he had elijahs cloak and parted water by striking it with the cloak but it doesn't figure any more in his long history IIRC

 

[Plane Sailing]

I give out a lot less gold, now. Instead, I give out 'powers' that work exactly like magic items that the characters get from their deity, flavored by the deity, and by the character. So instead of getting a Belt of Strength +2, they just get +2 Strength. To balance it out, I take roughly double the cost of the magic item, and subtract that from any treasure I give them.

They're magic items in everything but flavor, and give me a good excuse to tailor them to the individual, while simultaneously enriching the campaign setting.

I like this idea. As you intimate it takes a particular campaign setting for it to work well, but it is a nice idea.

I wonder how the Bloodlines in UA might work out to this end? Or was it Midnight that has the "heroic paths" for PCs?

 

[Henry]

you see i know the story tho.

there is a reason why he wants his eye and hand back.

The thing is, there are thousands of gamers out there who have heard of the eye and hand of Vecna who DON'T know the story. I'm mainly referring to how those two things are tied to his legend in an indelible way. Gamers who don't know and couldn't care less about Vecna's origins still know those are two powerful items and want them for themselves.

I agree that it's tied to him differently than Arthur and Excalibur or Elric/Stormbringer, but Vecna the character is still defined in part by the existance and powers of his Eye and Hand. They play a major role.

 

[Henry]

I can't see how he could have been even partially described this way - he had elijahs cloak and parted water by striking it with the cloak but it doesn't figure any more in his long history IIRC

It's an important part of his story, that he carried the cloak, is it not? He carried Elijah's cloak throughout his days as a prophet, unless I'm misremembering. It's not the only defining thing about Elisha, but it is one of the closest things to an artifact in the Bible, short of the Ark, Moses' staff, and the brass serpent.