Class Acts: Duelist Rogue

[Rechan]

Dungeons & Dragons Roleplaying Game Official Home Page - Article (The Duelist Rogue)

Ok. Several things here which make me go "Wait, what?"

The At-will makes me scratch my head. What is the point to this?

The last feat - Versatile Duelist - makes me pause. While at first blush I think this will be powerful, on the other hand - how many one-handed military heavy blades are that powerful? Or useful. Beyond the Longsword or Broadsword? What's left, the khopesh?

 

[zerotkatama]

As to the at-will, it seems the intent is to give positioning capability, as well as a last-ditch way to give SA.

 

[Mentat55]

Being able to deal your Sneak Attack damage without combat advantage is nice, but only doing Dexterity modifier damage (and no Weapon Focus, enhancement bonuses, item bonuses, etc.) makes it pretty weak compared to Sly Flourish. I guess the duelist is supposed to fight enemies mano e mano, kind of like the avenger.

The first two weapons I thought of for Versatile Duelist were the bastard sword (sure you need to spend another feat) and the scimitar (for Scimitar Dance). And being able to use Heavy Blade Opportunity, especially for brutal scoundrel rogues, isn't bad.

 

[zerotkatama]

I definently like what Lashing Blade and Shimmering Blade do - Readied actions that aren't readied actions, and can happen more than once.

 

[thewok]

Regarding the At-Will, think of it this way: At any time, you have two at-will powers. Normally a rogue needs CA to deal sneak attack damage. With Duelist's Flurry, you now have a way to deal sneak attack damage every round. Now, CA just gives you the opportunity to do a bit more damage. I imagine this is very useful for Small rogues, like my level 8 gnome, who has low strength, but very high dexterity. So, I'll be dealing at least 2d8+4 damage every round when I hit, rather than 1d4+4. That's a nice damage boost.

There's also the positioning ability. I get to do sneak attack damage while moving the monster into position to flank with another party member. Or maybe I cut off an escape route. I actually really like this ability the more I think about it.

 

[Dannager]

A 9th level rogue gives up, probably:

4 (Cha bonus) + 2 (enhancement bonus) + 3 (miscellaneous bonus) = 9 damage

...when using the new at-will over Sly Flourish. A 9th level rogue, however, gains 9 damage with this attack if he is able to use his sneak attack damage when he otherwise couldn't. Furthermore, a critical hit with the new at-will rewards an extra 9 damage above Sly Flourish without sneak attack.

In other words, the new at-will definitely has some uses. I like it.

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

If you don't have combat advantage, I think the new at-will will be nice, but it is more situational than many other At-Wills. It can be a good choice at higher levels when you have more encounter or daily powers to use, and for Humans.

The last feat - Versatile Duelist - makes me pause. While at first blush I think this will be powerful, on the other hand - how many one-handed military heavy blades are that powerful? Or useful. Beyond the Longsword or Broadsword? What's left, the khopesh?

This feat allows you to use a Longsword instead of a Rapier, basically. It is not more effective on its own. But there might be heavy-blade based feats that could be interesting to a Rogue, particularly a Duelist. Heavy Blade Opportunity for example?
Eladrin Rogues might now have a reason to take Eladrin soldier at least for the heroic tier.
The thing is not the weapon on its own, but any related feats or powers that might come into play.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I think some of those feats are worth taking for multiclass/hybrid rogues:

- blade and buckler duellist: light shield upgraded to heavy shield without -2 ACP
- versatile duellist: multiclassing rogue for extra 2d6 damage on multiclass rogue powers, without the need of switching weapons.

careful: this feat doesn´t work on melee basic attacks or twin attacks etc.

wasn´t there a feat which allowed eladrins to use a longsword for SA?

 

[Klaus]

I think some of those feats are worth taking for multiclass/hybrid rogues:

- blade and buckler duellist: light shield upgraded to heavy shield without -2 ACP
- versatile duellist: multiclassing rogue for extra 2d6 damage on multiclass rogue powers, without the need of switching weapons.

careful: this feat doesn´t work on melee basic attacks or twin attacks etc.

wasn´t there a feat which allowed eladrins to use a longsword for SA?

Longsword Finesse. It reduced the SA damage by 1 die.

 

[Jack99]

A 9th level rogue gives up, probably:

4 (Cha bonus) + 2 (enhancement bonus) + 3 (miscellaneous bonus) = 9 damage

...when using the new at-will over Sly Flourish. A 9th level rogue, however, gains 9 damage with this attack if he is able to use his sneak attack damage when he otherwise couldn't. Furthermore, a critical hit with the new at-will rewards an extra 9 damage above Sly Flourish without sneak attack.

In other words, the new at-will definitely has some uses. I like it.

It gets even better as the rogue gains levels and SA damage improves significantly.

The last feat - Versatile Duelist - makes me pause. While at first blush I think this will be powerful, on the other hand - how many one-handed military heavy blades are that powerful? Or useful. Beyond the Longsword or Broadsword? What's left, the khopesh?

It's a feat a lot of people have been waiting for, to make for better fighter/rogue multiclass and hybrids.