Class HP vs Race HP
- Thread starter swordsmasher
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Terath Ninir
Yog Sothoth loves you
HellHound said:
I've seen it in UA -- I think -- and at least one other place. If it wasn't in there, then in two other places.
I don't think I've seen a full game book built around it, though.The idea would have some merit if hit points were purely about physical toughness. Since that's a minor component at most (dude factor being MUCH more important
), it doesn't make sense for d20 in my mind.
Yeah, "Farscape" was the one I thought of when I saw the original question.
I'm a bit torn on the issue. Later progression with hit dice based on class works great, but I've always itched to give bonus point(s) based on race at first level.
Wouldn't our hypothetical half-orc wizard have more hps (even if minimal) than a human or even halfling wizard at first level? Then again, I'd want a 1st level human sorcerer who grew up with a hard life amongst the barbarians to have an extra point or two over a 1st level human sorcerer who lead an insulated (aristocratic?) life. Maybe it would be something to include in a regional feat (which IIRC forgotten realms has some that were essentially racial rather than geographic in nature available to be chosen).
Never done either, though. I try to be RAW, although not limited to just the core books.
I'm a bit torn on the issue. Later progression with hit dice based on class works great, but I've always itched to give bonus point(s) based on race at first level.
Wouldn't our hypothetical half-orc wizard have more hps (even if minimal) than a human or even halfling wizard at first level? Then again, I'd want a 1st level human sorcerer who grew up with a hard life amongst the barbarians to have an extra point or two over a 1st level human sorcerer who lead an insulated (aristocratic?) life. Maybe it would be something to include in a regional feat (which IIRC forgotten realms has some that were essentially racial rather than geographic in nature available to be chosen).
Never done either, though. I try to be RAW, although not limited to just the core books.
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Shin Okada
Explorer
For some combination of race and class, racial substitution level is doing that. For example, a 1st level Dwarf fighter who takes racial substitution level has a HD of d12.
And, in most cases, the toughness you have suggested is represented by either high Con or Toughness feat. Or, in case of monster races, with the number of racial HD.
In case of Half-Orc, Orcs and Half-Orcs are not particularly tough race (high Con or some racial HD) in current DnD. They are stronger, but not tougher than human race. If your image of Orcs and Half-Orcs are much tougher, maybe you should better change the stats of those races in your campaign.
And, in most cases, the toughness you have suggested is represented by either high Con or Toughness feat. Or, in case of monster races, with the number of racial HD.
In case of Half-Orc, Orcs and Half-Orcs are not particularly tough race (high Con or some racial HD) in current DnD. They are stronger, but not tougher than human race. If your image of Orcs and Half-Orcs are much tougher, maybe you should better change the stats of those races in your campaign.
Asmor
First Post
Hit points are not solely a measure of toughness, they're a measure of training as well. For example, a higher level rogue being hit with a hammer knows how to move to minimize the impact.
When you take damage, it doesn't neccessarily even mean that the weapon actually connected with you. It could have been an entirely too close call that you narrowly avoided, exerting yourself and making you lose a bit of your nerve. On the same token, just because an attack "misses" you doesn't mean it didn't hit you... In fact, any attack equal to your touch attack AC but lower than your normal AC would in fact strike you and be deflected by your armor.
The point is, hit points and armor class are an entirely abstract system that really doesn't make a whole lot of sense, so trying to apply common sense to it really breaks things. Just accept them for what they are: A balancing factor to keep the game fun and make sure that more experienced characters are noticably more able than less experienced ones.
When you take damage, it doesn't neccessarily even mean that the weapon actually connected with you. It could have been an entirely too close call that you narrowly avoided, exerting yourself and making you lose a bit of your nerve. On the same token, just because an attack "misses" you doesn't mean it didn't hit you... In fact, any attack equal to your touch attack AC but lower than your normal AC would in fact strike you and be deflected by your armor.
The point is, hit points and armor class are an entirely abstract system that really doesn't make a whole lot of sense, so trying to apply common sense to it really breaks things. Just accept them for what they are: A balancing factor to keep the game fun and make sure that more experienced characters are noticably more able than less experienced ones.
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