Classed based defense bonuses for D&D classes
- Thread starter Kobold Avenger
- Start date
Spyritwind
First Post
It's been a very long time since I cruised these boards and a long time since I had a system for this (that I don't remember off hand), but here are some things to consider.
The system was created for the armored person to have the best defense in most situations so if you give high reflex save classes the best AC boost it will/may take that away. IE fighters may not have the highest AC any more which would probably be a bad thing. Yes of course non heavy wearing armor types are usualy the ones that need the AC the most, but ... that is for a reason.
Is the class based AC bonus mearly based on muscle twitch fiber reaction time, or does it incorperate combat perception and experience? IE does it include that ability to fight?
Reflexes and agility can certainly help, but knowing how to fight incorperates a lot of things such as timing, distance etc. Granted this has to do with hth combat and not really ranged combat.
If the AC bonus is a dodge bonus then would heavy armor, or being encumbered affect it? Granted being encumbered already includes an AC penalty, but having a high dex already gives you an AC bonus assuming you are not wearing heavy armor that limits it. Hmmm ...
I'll think on it more and if I remember my idea's from about 2 years ago I'll postem, but I think I may have had an AC bonus seperate for hth and another for ranged attack. The hth one was based on BAB and I think the other one, if there was one, was probably based on reflex save.
The system was created for the armored person to have the best defense in most situations so if you give high reflex save classes the best AC boost it will/may take that away. IE fighters may not have the highest AC any more which would probably be a bad thing. Yes of course non heavy wearing armor types are usualy the ones that need the AC the most, but ... that is for a reason.
Is the class based AC bonus mearly based on muscle twitch fiber reaction time, or does it incorperate combat perception and experience? IE does it include that ability to fight?
Reflexes and agility can certainly help, but knowing how to fight incorperates a lot of things such as timing, distance etc. Granted this has to do with hth combat and not really ranged combat.
If the AC bonus is a dodge bonus then would heavy armor, or being encumbered affect it? Granted being encumbered already includes an AC penalty, but having a high dex already gives you an AC bonus assuming you are not wearing heavy armor that limits it. Hmmm ...
I'll think on it more and if I remember my idea's from about 2 years ago I'll postem, but I think I may have had an AC bonus seperate for hth and another for ranged attack. The hth one was based on BAB and I think the other one, if there was one, was probably based on reflex save.
Jack Daniel
Legend
I use the d20 Modern defense bonus, and I line it up as follows:
Barbarian, Fighter, Paladin, Ranger = Good
Monk = Medium + 2 (same as the Fast Hero)
Rogue, Bard, Cleric, Druid, Psychic Warrior = Medium
Wizard, Sorcerer, Psion = Poor
I am not sure how abusable this is... but I *really* like it 'flavor' wise. It seems like a neat way to decide what type of fighter you want to be.
From a balance point of view, it would make sense. But I kinda like it without. I think of it as part of character creation, what type of fighter do you want to be?
Or rather, I would let you use the feat, but only at first level.
(course, I may decide to say the fighter can no longer pick up the armor feats later either... hmmm)
.
Kobold Avenger
Legend
Since I have armor bonuses stacking with class defense bonuses, I believe that any class which can use at least medium armor (all classes actually lost heavy armor profeciency) shouldn't have good defense bonuses. Though there are always variants available, so a class can lose medium armor profeciency and get a good defense bonus as a variant.
widderslainte
Explorer
Want a simple method? Instead of adding the Dex bonus to your AC, use the reflex save.
A method I used recently:
AC=10+BAB+Reflex save+Shield
(A good fighter will know how to dodge/parry(presented by BAB), someone who has good reflexes will do so without a thought)
Works good, but I have to say that our campaing was low-magic, Livepoints were used instead of traditional Hitpoints and were set equal to Constitution (+5 for medium-sized creatures, +0 for Small ones,...),
Armor converted real damage to subdual damage, the original Hitpoints just were good to soak subdual damage. Also we didn't reach high levels yet.
AC=10+BAB+Reflex save+Shield
(A good fighter will know how to dodge/parry(presented by BAB), someone who has good reflexes will do so without a thought)
Works good, but I have to say that our campaing was low-magic, Livepoints were used instead of traditional Hitpoints and were set equal to Constitution (+5 for medium-sized creatures, +0 for Small ones,...),
Armor converted real damage to subdual damage, the original Hitpoints just were good to soak subdual damage. Also we didn't reach high levels yet.
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A method my group is using
My group uses a completely different set of house rules for our game. We borrowed bits and pieces from different games to come up with something somewhat realistic and at the same time keep the heroic atmosphere. Here is an example of our Class Defense system.
Monks - Get Excellent progression
1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20
Barbarians, Fighters, Paladins, Rangers and Rogues - Get Good progression (1,2,3,3,4,5,6,6,7,8,9,9,10,11,12,12,13,14,15,15)
Bards, Clerics, and Druids - Get Average progression (0,1,2,2,3,3,4,4,5,5,6,6,7,7,8,8,9,9,10,10)
Sorcerers and Wizards - Get Poor progression (0,1,1,1,1,2,2,2,2,3,3,3,3,4,4,4,4,5,5,5)
We use wound points (equal to Consitution score)
Armor and Natural Armor provide Damage Reduction vs. Wound Point damage. Armor can be bypassed by Brilliant Energy weapons, and Natural Armor can be bypassed by Bane weapons for that creature type.
Defense represents a characters ability to dodge, roll out of the way, jump back, parry with a weapon, basically whatever it takes to avoid getting hit.
Defense = 10 + Dex + Class Bonus + Shield + size + misc.
When adding Dex to Defense, we treat it like the old Armor Class rules did. So if someone is wearing Full Plate with a Dexterity of 16, they only get a +1 to Dex.
Right now in my game our level 10 monk has a Defense of 30, but he has no Damage Reduction... so he is hard to hit.. but if he is hit it hurts. The Rogue 8/Ranger2 has a Defense of 25, and the level 10 Bard has a Defense of 21.
Your typical first level fighter will have a Defense of 12, while a level 20 fighter will have a Defense of 32+
Defense stacks with multiclassing characters...
so a Rogue 5/Sorcerer 3 would have a +5 Defense (+4 Rogue +1 Sorcerer)
My group uses a completely different set of house rules for our game. We borrowed bits and pieces from different games to come up with something somewhat realistic and at the same time keep the heroic atmosphere. Here is an example of our Class Defense system.
Monks - Get Excellent progression
1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20
Barbarians, Fighters, Paladins, Rangers and Rogues - Get Good progression (1,2,3,3,4,5,6,6,7,8,9,9,10,11,12,12,13,14,15,15)
Bards, Clerics, and Druids - Get Average progression (0,1,2,2,3,3,4,4,5,5,6,6,7,7,8,8,9,9,10,10)
Sorcerers and Wizards - Get Poor progression (0,1,1,1,1,2,2,2,2,3,3,3,3,4,4,4,4,5,5,5)
We use wound points (equal to Consitution score)
Armor and Natural Armor provide Damage Reduction vs. Wound Point damage. Armor can be bypassed by Brilliant Energy weapons, and Natural Armor can be bypassed by Bane weapons for that creature type.
Defense represents a characters ability to dodge, roll out of the way, jump back, parry with a weapon, basically whatever it takes to avoid getting hit.
Defense = 10 + Dex + Class Bonus + Shield + size + misc.
When adding Dex to Defense, we treat it like the old Armor Class rules did. So if someone is wearing Full Plate with a Dexterity of 16, they only get a +1 to Dex.
Right now in my game our level 10 monk has a Defense of 30, but he has no Damage Reduction... so he is hard to hit.. but if he is hit it hurts. The Rogue 8/Ranger2 has a Defense of 25, and the level 10 Bard has a Defense of 21.
Your typical first level fighter will have a Defense of 12, while a level 20 fighter will have a Defense of 32+
Defense stacks with multiclassing characters...
so a Rogue 5/Sorcerer 3 would have a +5 Defense (+4 Rogue +1 Sorcerer)
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