D&D 4E Classless D&D 4e: A game designer's ramblings

[Darkwolf71]

And yet, D&D has been moving towards a classless sytem. 3e multiclassing turned classes into 'lego blocks' for building custom characters.

I can't really see this as a move towards 'classless'

D20Modern introduced very generic classes (I liked them!) with Talent Trees for class abilities and no multiclassing restrictions.

Great for what it is. What it isn't however, is D&D modern.

4e unifies BAB/Save progression.

Don't know what I feel about this. I'm not crazy about it at face value, but haven't passed judgment since I haven't seen the whole beast.

Really, the leap to a single 'class' (perhaps 3 classes: PC (also used for 'major' villains), Mundane NPC (bakers and blacksmiths), and Monsters) is the next logical step in this progression.

Sorry, I just don't see it that way.

 

[AZRogue]

They're not going to make classless DnD. They're going to use their base mechanic and modular system--with it's unified character progression--and set out the character classes and other elements which they feel embody DnD and its heroic fantasy style of play.

What's nice, though, is that the rules seem as though they'll be very modular and the system transparent enough for a DM to tinker around and tailor everything the way he wants. It's potentially a lot more freedom than we've ever had before (for the amount of work it would take, I mean). It's all still DnD .... until you make it something else. That you can do so without spending three months in a Tibetan cave chained to a computer with a host of playtesters at your disposal is nice.

I wouldn't expect any support except for the core assumptions of the game--heroic fantasy--as laid out in the PHB, DMG, and MM, though. Maybe in a future supplement or article. Some exciting potential, though, IMO.

 

[GreatLemur]

Yeah, I realized this a few days ago, actually. True20 already proved you could hack D&D 3e into something nearly classless. D&D 4e's more lack of class-specific bonus progressions and focus on better class parity should make that kind of thing even easier.

D&D is just the "prime" product, but perhaps they may follow-up by a more generic, more customizable version - the motor of the "game system" so to speak.

Aw, man, I wish.

Actually, come to think of it, we do know they're doing a new version of d20 Modern, and I think that could kind of be said to have this role. Despite the "Modern" appellation, d20M is definitely kind of a setting-neutral construction kit.

That said, I think that 4e is going to be a lot of fun for gearheads. We've taken systematic, standardized approach to the underlying numbers and design. That sort of structure really pays off when you start bending, folding, and mutilating.

God, that's what I like to hear. This kind of thing is so damned much more important to me than where demons came from and how tall frigging halflings are.

 

[helium3]

Doesn't this also describe like a ton of other fantasy rpgs on the market as well?

Well obviously they're D&D as well!!

Personally, I think this simplifies the discussion immensely and allows us to do away with that whole GNS rubbish.

 

[DonTadow]

That's pretty much how i run my game now. First with buy the numbers and now with steampunk ogl.

I like the steampunk ogl appraoch better, where you can pick any ability within a set archtype, but you can choose some 25 to 30 an archetype. If you want to go into other arcehtypes you sacrafice a feat.

 

[SSquirrel]

Specifically here is that classless spreadsheet I mentioned earlier: http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=82858&highlight=spunj