Cleave and AoO

[Dimwhit]

Could someone point out where in the rules it states you can't use cleave with an Attack of Opportunity? I've checked the core books and the FAQs, but I may have missed it.

 

[Xarlen]

You can use it with an AoO. But I don't know where it says this.

 

[hong]

There is no such rule.

 

[Dimwhit]

Then does someone know where you says you can use them both? My group insists that you cannot cleave with an AoO, since the attack is only against the person provoking it.

 

[hong]

Then does someone know where you says you can use them both?

There is also no such rule.

What has come about is a consensus that the description of Cleave ("make an immediate attack...") trumps the combat chapter in the PHB ("you must use the full attack action...") in terms of when you can use this feat. It doesn't cause any problems in terms of balance.

One reason to disallow Cleaving on an AoO is that it results in strangeness, which is what may have prompted your group's reaction. Let's say Bob and Joe Orc are fighting Bill the Barbarian. Bob is knocked down to 2 hit points, so he digs out a CLW potion and starts drinking it (being an orc, he forgot about the 5-foot step thing). Bill immediately gets an AoO against Bob, kills him, and then proceeds to Cleave against Joe, who hadn't done anything stupid or let down his guard.

Even this, however, tends to come up very rarely in my experience.

 

[gtJormungand]

After using the AoO to drop someone, you then get to Cleave in another creature in your reach. You still only get one Cleave Attempt per turn (unless you have Great Cleave), so if you already used it, you don't have another one because of this.

 

[Mordeth]

I have read somewhere

that you could whirlwind, and when something is killed, stop the whirlwind, resolve the cleave, if you kill with the cleave, resolve the great cleaves, and then resume the whirlwind... repeating as needed...

 

[dr_nukem]

Even this, however, tends to come up very rarely in my experience.

Funny enough, this just happened in our weekly campaign. The half-orc in our group infiltrated an orc camp. When they finally realized they were under attack (from the human members of our party) they reacted. The half-orc let a group of archers move past him until the last 2 came by. At that point, he decided to take his AoO, killing the first archer, and immediately took his cleave attack on the second (missed, but the thought was there).

The key point is that with Cleave, you only get to do this ONCE per round. So, if you attack, kill, then cleave, you can't cleave as part of an AoO.

Originally posted by Mordeth
that you could whirlwind, and when something is killed, stop the whirlwind, resolve the cleave, if you kill with the cleave, resolve the great cleaves, and then resume the whirlwind... repeating as needed...

100% correct. If you have Greater Cleave and Whirlwind attack, you can really get quite a few attacks. One thing to consider, you can not take a 5' step as part of your cleave attack. You CAN however take a 5' step as part of your whirlwind attack... If you're a 6th level fighter attacking a bunch of CR 1 creatures...you're going to do some serious carnage...

 

[kreynolds]

You CAN however take a 5' step as part of your whirlwind attack...

...but only before or after, not during.

 

[dr_nukem]

You 100% sure there?

Full attack [Full][AoO: No]

Description: If a combatant gets more than one attack per action, the combatant must use the full attack action to use those additional attacks. A combatant does not need to specify the targets of a the attacks ahead of time. A combatant can see how the earlier attacks turn out before assigning the later ones.

The combatant may take a 5 ft. step before, after, or between the attacks.

Whirlwind is a full attack action...